Protecting an overpair in a large field / River "value bet"

[Buzz-cp]

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No need to be sarcastic. I wanted to know if earlier in the hand (especially the flop) a check would be really ridiculous, since the pot equity is not that big,

I knew I was ahead. Of course. If it's that stupid to you, sorry, I'll post in the "nano limit hold'em for suckers forum who can't ask a question politely"

In SSHE, Ed Miller draws a distinction between two overpair hands, TT and AA with raggedy board in A LARGE MULTIWAY POT.
He explains how is the equity different in both cases and made me think about that precise hand. Sorry I took your time and wasted it in such a hopeless way.

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I was actually writing my post before your message posted before mine came out. Your OP seriously had "someone is calling my river bet with a weak flush" written all over it. You are certainly not wasting my time. If anyone is responsible for that, it is me [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[marchron]

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I knew I was ahead. Of course. If it's that stupid to you, sorry, I'll post in the "nano limit hold'em for suckers forum who can't ask a question politely"

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Hmmm . . .

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I bet, I bet, I bet. At no point I knew where I was standing.

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You didn't sound too confident about whether or not you were ahead until we all told you that you were.


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In SSHE, Ed Miller draws a distinction between two overpair hands, TT and AA with raggedy board in A LARGE MULTIWAY POT.
He explains how is the equity different in both cases and made me think about that precise hand. Sorry I took your time and wasted it in such a hopeless way.

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The difference is that in those hands, we have the option of whether to RAISE a bet on the flop or smooth-call and RAISE THE SAME GUY'S BET on the turn. Obvious emphasis on RAISE.

Your choice here isn't between calling and raising, it's between checking or betting. While betting offers +EV odds to all sorts of hands, checking offers infinite odds. So betting is the lesser of two bad options. It's okay; I've made this mistake, too.

Besides, even with the schooling effect, you're not nearly as FUBAR'd as you think you are. Let's just assume that half the deck is bad for you; well, then you "own" half of this pot in equity, and you'll "own" half of all the bets that go in on the flop. That's a lot of freakin' bets, and well worth it to start putting some more in, as opposed to freaking out and checking in the vain hope that one of these fish will let you check/raise them, or that you'll lose less if one of the boogeyman cards does come on the turn.

[AbZurrrd]

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You didn't sound too confident about whether or not you were ahead until we all told you that you were.

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Yeah I know this sounds pretty contradictory with what I've said before. At no point I knew where I was standing in terms of equity, and as you point out, a lot of cards would have hurt me.

About SSHE, you are right the situation is not the same, and this is why I posted the original hand. I should have more precisely about how to minimize the schooling effect, not if betting was fine [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Thanks all for your comments. To me, reducing the implicit collusion is at the very least a +.5 BB/100 added value in the long run, if not more and I've always wondered what is the best strategy, since apparently "POUND POUND POUND" is not always the best solution. I come from NL land, so this is something I'm learning and I will NEVER complain here about "Wow he sucked out on me" but rather learn how to exploit it.

And for the little story, he had TT and played it in the most unprofitable way IMHO

Edit: what does FUBAR mean?

[pokerbratwurst]

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Edit: what does FUBAR mean?

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Seriously? F*ed up beyond all recognition.

[shuinthehouse]

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And for the little story, he had TT and played it in the most unprofitable way IMHO

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You are almost always going to get [censored] upon if you post results. And I'm not sure villain played this that bad, he got the most out of you if you had UI overs, and lost the least if you had JJ-AA. He may have planned on bet/folding the river but changed his mind when 3rd flush hit.

[ESKiMO-SiCKNE5S]

god this is so standard