Since when is top set a tough hand?

[UtzChips]

If the Turn pairs the board I am betting/raising, otherwise I am calling, even if the Turn card makes a 1 card str8 flush possible, I'm in to the Showdown if the River card pairs the board, but I won't raise on the River with a full house and the str8 flush possible if I have 2 opponents.

I believe this is one of those rare instances where aggression with a set gets you nowhere until you're sure you have the best hand (other than someone having flopped a str8 flush).

[Crimson]

I disagree.

I raise this PF. With a big field like thats its +EV, and it gives you an advantage postflop.

As you played it, I like a smooth call here so you can raise a good turn or river if its safe or you fill up. The nice thing about these hands is also that when you hit, your going to get paid off big because alot of players call with all sorts of [censored] on a board like that.

[Alex424]

[ QUOTE ]
"Everyone" limps to me on the Button and I have 88. No way am I raising. I am playing this for set value and folding on almost all Flops.


[/ QUOTE ]

Raising preflop is for set value and you may even get a free card on the flop if required

[UtzChips]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
"Everyone" limps to me on the Button and I have 88. No way am I raising. I am playing this for set value and folding on almost all Flops.


[/ QUOTE ]

Raising preflop is for set value and you may even get a free card on the flop if required

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you quote any published author and his/her article/book on poker that agrees with you?

[UtzChips]

[ QUOTE ]
I disagree.

I raise this PF. With a big field like thats its +EV, and it gives you an advantage postflop.

[/ QUOTE ]

If somebody limped with AT and the Flop is ten high, Heros is getting no advantage postflop. In fact, I can think of no instance, other than a 8 high flop, in which a raise preflop is to Hero's advantage.

Raising on the Button against 2 opponents is one thing, six is quite another.

[ QUOTE ]
As you played it, I like a smooth call here so you can raise a good turn or river if its safe or you fill up. The nice thing about these hands is also that when you hit, your going to get paid off big because alot of players call with all sorts of [censored] on a board like that.

[/ QUOTE ]

If one of those six flopped a flush, which is quite likely, you are going to pay thru the nose when you raise on the Turn without a full house.
Even if the lead bettor has nothing but the A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], leads out and several call and then you raise, he should re-raise hoping to convince a small made flush that his is bigger, as it is only costing him 1 more bet.

[Dazarath]

[ QUOTE ]
As you played it, I like a smooth call here so you can raise a good turn or river if its safe or you fill up. The nice thing about these hands is also that when you hit, your going to get paid off big because alot of players call with all sorts of [censored] on a board like that.

[/ QUOTE ]

There's no reason to wait for a safe turn. Even if someone showed you his nut flush, you're still correct to raise, given that it's 5-way. I don't have PokerStove installed at the moment, but I guarantee that your set has more than 20% equity, even if we assume that one opponent has a flush.

[brettbrettr]

You don't wait for a safe turn in a 5-way pot with top set.

[Alex424]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
"Everyone" limps to me on the Button and I have 88. No way am I raising. I am playing this for set value and folding on almost all Flops.


[/ QUOTE ]

Raising preflop is for set value and you may even get a free card on the flop if required

[/ QUOTE ]

Can you quote any published author and his/her article/book on poker that agrees with you?

[/ QUOTE ]

Sklansky, Miller, Jones, - need i go on.

The reason you raise is because you have fantastic odds and you make a bigger pot for everybody else so if you hit a set you now have an enormous pot to which everybody else will now have to call down to their weak draws.

Raising a pocket pair after this many limpers is so standard it is in every holdem book there is. The same applies with strong suited connectors like QJs 109s

[Alex424]

Another major advantage in raising preflop on the button with a pocket pair with loads of limpers is you have an excellent chance of taking a free card and possibly hitting a set on the turn

IF YOU LIKE MONEY RAISE

[SA125]

[ QUOTE ]
Just call, and charge the max on the turn if it's safe (non 4, 5, 9, T, spade)

[/ QUOTE ]

[ QUOTE ]
The problem with just calling is that 5-ways you won't be getting turn raises in often enough unless your hand isn't the best.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with Josh that this is a good spot to just call. There's a bunch of cards that come off we hate. But also a bunch we like where it's not likely to get ch'd around and you'll still have the best hand when someone bets.