Letter to a Christian Nation

[SuitedDucks]

[ QUOTE ]
If you think it's about love and understanding, you certainly aren't Christian, as the Old Testament is the most violent, abhorrent books ever written, and even the watered-down new testament is full of violence.



[/ QUOTE ]

where is there violence in the new testament?

[Dominic]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If you think it's about love and understanding, you certainly aren't Christian, as the Old Testament is the most violent, abhorrent books ever written, and even the watered-down new testament is full of violence.



[/ QUOTE ]

where is there violence in the new testament?

[/ QUOTE ]

I seem to recall a dude getting nailed to a cross...I could be wrong, though...

[SuitedDucks]

isnt the posters point that there is violence being committed by Christians in the new testament? or maybe i'm just reading his argument all wrong.

[FortunaMaximus]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If you think it's about love and understanding, you certainly aren't Christian, as the Old Testament is the most violent, abhorrent books ever written, and even the watered-down new testament is full of violence.



[/ QUOTE ]

where is there violence in the new testament?

[/ QUOTE ]

I seem to recall a dude getting nailed to a cross...I could be wrong, though...

[/ QUOTE ]

Well. That could be taken out of context, like everything else.

Bible = Book, after all. Great messages though.

K.

[daveT]

Am I the only one that finds it ironic that "sinners" (gamblers) are actually debating the merits of living a good Christian life?

I mean, yeah, live by the book and as you are told to believe, don't sin or you go to hell, yet we all pilfer in one of the 7 sins, and (OMFG!) play poker, or use other impulses for wagering.

I don't need to read a book to know that it is wrong to kill, but this thread......

I mean, Jesus Crimeny!

Confusious: He who lives in a glass house should not throw stones.

[Enrique]

[ QUOTE ]

I'm curious of what you think of centuries worth of miracles documented by the Catholic Church (the Stigmata of Padre Pio and the Miracle of the Sun at Lourdes come to mind) and their impact (if any) on your burden of proof requirements.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm curious what you think of centuries worth of no miracles and of science disproving the miracles claimed.
Also, the Catholic Church has an interest in converting, so why would someone trust when they claim miracles.
I saw that people want to canonize John Paul II, which is a good idea, but they have to prove he did two miracles, so people are claiming he healed them with miracles. I don't think anyone believes he did any miracle, yet they are trying to pass things he did as miracles.

The Odyseey and the Illiad documents some really awesome miracles, yet I don't think anyone believes Athena fought on the wars of the Greeks.

[Bigdaddydvo]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

I'm curious of what you think of centuries worth of miracles documented by the Catholic Church (the Stigmata of Padre Pio and the Miracle of the Sun at Lourdes come to mind) and their impact (if any) on your burden of proof requirements.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm curious what you think of centuries worth of no miracles and of science disproving the miracles claimed.
Also, the Catholic Church has an interest in converting, so why would someone trust when they claim miracles.
I saw that people want to canonize John Paul II, which is a good idea, but they have to prove he did two miracles, so people are claiming he healed them with miracles. I don't think anyone believes he did any miracle, yet they are trying to pass things he did as miracles.

The Odyseey and the Illiad documents some really awesome miracles, yet I don't think anyone believes Athena fought on the wars of the Greeks.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you're prepared to present scientific evidence that refutes the miracles I've cited, please post it.

[Enrique]

I read some news on Padre Pio and his stigmata.
From what I read, the Vatican did some investigations of him and came to the conclusion that he was a fraud (investigations in the 60's). That he inflicted the stigmata on himself using acid.
Pope John Paul II had a great love of Padre Pio because he went on a pilgrimmage to see him when he was young and asked him to pray so that someone would be cured from cancer. Apparently that person got cured from cancer and Pope John Paul II thought it was because of Padre Pio's prayers.
I prefer (using Ockham's Razor) to think the simple solution that she got cured from cancer by other factors that don't involve prayer. Many are possible:
1) She never had cancer and only thought she had.
2) She got cured by natural means.
3) Her case did not exist.

I also think that the earlier investigations on Padre Pio make more sense (that he was a fraud). Because when they re-evaluated his case, it was because of Pope John Paul II's insistence. His insistence is based on personal events, which blind reason.

I think the explanation that is was acid makes more sense than to think he had stigmata.

Sources:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pio_of_Pietrelcina
http://www.forteantimes.com/articles/162_padrepio.shtml

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
first of all, there really is no such thing as "atheism."

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, there is. It is the affirmative belief that no divinity exists.


[/ QUOTE ]

If you successfully integrate an argument in the very terms used in the discussion, you have already won the discussion before it has even begun.

If you get away with it, your opponent was overmatched to begin with. You may have lent more heat than light, but if the object is winning rather than coming to a clearer understanding - as perhaps most discussions are - well, you have won.

[Blarg]

That pope also went on an unprecedented binge of granting sainthoods such as was never done before and may never be done again. Getting a sainthood from this guy wasn't exactly leaping through hoops.