The Limp Re-raise at 200NL

[galahad_187]

i was gunna say what sawyer said - definatly have long term implied odds for a set.

if we hit your set whats our best chance at getting his entire stack?
bet the pot? if he doesn't raise bet it all the way down and make him think he's getting paid by QQ or something?

if you bet the pot and he raises it'll either be a push or he'll be committed so you can comfortably be all in on any turn.

what about if we bet half the pot and he calls? raises?

normally my line would be to bet 3/4th the pot, if his raise doesn't commit him i check to him on the turn, if he checks behind i bet howevermuch on the river i need to get my implied odds :P (or more ,depending on pot size) if he bets turn and commits himself i just push in. if he only calls my pot bet then i normally bet 1/2 pot on the turn - since he'll probably call, then i push river. if it isn't more than pot bet.

thoughts? i see mto have a problem extracting at times even though i mix it up like crazy. once i got on a run and literally did something 100% differant everytime and still felt each time it wasn't anywhere near maxium extraction.

although i guess in a pot this big it's way easier =\ bet out and expect to be raised!

you may even want to consider pushing a K Q x where the X isn't an ace flop.

KQ flops after 3 bets are the scariest flops there is. of course it may end up looking like a complete donk bet when he flips over KK =]

[swarm]

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Fold PF. You do not have set odds.

LRR over a field of limpers+a raise and re-raise out of the blinds?

He has you beat.

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This is exactly correct, there are a lot of limp re-raisers of AA and KK at 1/2 and 2/4 UTG. The trick is when you have KK in the BB in this situation, that's always fun.

[n1bd]

[ QUOTE ]
7.5-1 to hit a set. ... If he gets paid of everytime he hits he's not just calling $30 to win $88 he's calling $30 to win $288, so $288-$30 (9.6-1) is a clear call.

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But sometimes you lose even after flopping a set. When your opponent starts with a higher pocket pair and doesn't fold, he will beat your set 18+%. And when you lose, you lose your stack.

So if you take the flop heads up against a higher pp, you actually need about 11:1 implied odds to break even, assuming you fold the flop unimproved and get all-in when you hit. If 3 or more people see the flop, it gets a little better because your implied odds increase relative to your reverse implied odds (unless the additional players are going to set-over-set you!). If you expect your pp to have other value even when it doesn't flop a set--like sometimes you can make your opponent fold, or sometimes you can show down the best hand without setting--then you can of course take worse odds too, whatever odds you think are right for that situation.

In this hand, Hero isn't getting good enough odds to draw if he folds unimproved, no matter what mix of hands Villain is playing and how often he pays off a set. If Villain doesn't have a higher pp, then Hero won't get paid off enough. If he does have a higher pp, Hero isn't getting his 11:1. The only way the check-fold unimproved plan can be +ev here is if Villain often holds a worse hand and checks it down, which is not happening after this action.

[J. Sawyer]

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[ QUOTE ]
7.5-1 to hit a set. ... If he gets paid of everytime he hits he's not just calling $30 to win $88 he's calling $30 to win $288, so $288-$30 (9.6-1) is a clear call.

[/ QUOTE ]

But sometimes you lose even after flopping a set. When your opponent starts with a higher pocket pair and doesn't fold, he will beat your set 18+%. And when you lose, you lose your stack.

So if you take the flop heads up against a higher pp, you actually need about 11:1 implied odds to break even, assuming you fold the flop unimproved and get all-in when you hit. If 3 or more people see the flop, it gets a little better because your implied odds increase relative to your reverse implied odds (unless the additional players are going to set-over-set you!). If you expect your pp to have other value even when it doesn't flop a set--like sometimes you can make your opponent fold, or sometimes you can show down the best hand without setting--then you can of course take worse odds too, whatever odds you think are right for that situation.

In this hand, Hero isn't getting good enough odds to draw if he folds unimproved, no matter what mix of hands Villain is playing and how often he pays off a set. If Villain doesn't have a higher pp, then Hero won't get paid off enough. If he does have a higher pp, Hero isn't getting his 11:1. The only way the check-fold unimproved plan can be +ev here is if Villain often holds a worse hand and checks it down, which is not happening after this action.

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