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#11
05-21-2006, 02:39 PM
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Re: Home Game Liar - What\'s your play?
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] Only rule he could have broken was "Revealing the contents of a live hand in a multihanded pot before the betting is completed..." [/ QUOTE ] smoore, you dont' have a problem with this, then? "deliberately miscalling a hand with the intent of causing another player to discard a winning hand is unethical and may result in forfeiture of the pot." [/ QUOTE ] I'ld only have a problem with it if the OP had first called the bet on the river, since I believe that the rule above refers to showdowns. 
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#12
05-21-2006, 02:39 PM
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Re: Home Game Liar - What\'s your play?
I've re-read the OP for the action and all I see is that BB led out with a half pot sized bet on the river that was not called by anyone. He was representing that he had some kind of a hand with his bet and his verbal statement matched his action. As his bet was never called, I don't see how his statement that he hit the straight is anymore of a misrepresentation of his hand than his half pot sized bet. All that ultimately happened was that "Mr. 32s Who Flops 2 Pair" didn't call down a good bluff and lost the pot.
Penalizing a player for making a statement that he hit his hand before he is called down and proven to be bluffing makes no sense to me. I see it as part of his bluff.
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#14
05-21-2006, 03:08 PM
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Re: Home Game Liar - What\'s your play?
Our home game "generally" tries to follow rules and etiquette, but players will sometimes talk about their hands while in play, and no one considers this "cheating." But we're all friends and it's easy to differentiate between kidding and angle-shooting among us.
Sometimes a player will "volunteer" what s/he's holding, sometimes a player will ask another player what s/he has. My feeling is, in a home game, if you ask another player what he has, and you expect him to tell the truth, whatever results you get are not reliable--you're better off just playing your hand and relying on other info. However, if a player volunteers what he has in an attempt to influence a hand, that is closer to shenanigans. But if you have a read on the player, it may work to his disadvantage. If it weren't a home game, I would expect the player who volunteers info or misinfo about his hand to have his hand mucked. You asked the player to show his cards and he obliged. Another player tried to get info on his hand and he decieved. To me, this other guy just took advantage of a situation that the two of you created.
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#15
05-21-2006, 03:56 PM
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Re: Home Game Liar - What\'s your play?
I can't belive that people really think there is anything wrong with this. Do you expect him to say "nope I got K5"
So if you think it is not allowed to lie about the comtent of your hand to get a player off his hand, you don't think it would be unethical to just simply ask the player, knowing he can't lie, to save yourself a bet.
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#16
05-21-2006, 05:32 PM
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Re: Home Game Liar - What\'s your play?
[ QUOTE ]
I can't belive that people really think there is anything wrong with this. Do you expect him to say "nope I got K5" So if you think it is not allowed to lie about the comtent of your hand to get a player off his hand, you don't think it would be unethical to just simply ask the player, knowing he can't lie, to save yourself a bet. [/ QUOTE ] I agree- I think i misinterpreted the situation, as smoore and others had pointed out. If the bet had been CALLED and then K5 misdeclared a hand to get the others to fold, then I think the rule could apply. Otherwise, I agree- bluff, not rules violation. However, AK hand should have kept his mouth shut- THAT was still a rules violation IMO.
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#17
05-21-2006, 05:36 PM
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Re: Home Game Liar - What\'s your play?
[ QUOTE ]
I look at him and say, "You hit the straight?" "Yea." "You show?" And then rolling his eyes as if doing me a favor, "Yea, I'll show." [/ QUOTE ] YOU BELIEVED HIM?!?!?! What if he said he had top pair, you call, and he shows a straight? I don't believe my mom when we are playing cards, and I've been lied to by my grandma at a table... UNBELIEVABLE! IT'S POKER!
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#18
05-21-2006, 06:01 PM
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Re: Home Game Liar - What\'s your play?
[ QUOTE ]
However, AK hand should have kept his mouth shut- THAT was still a rules violation IMO. [/ QUOTE ] It was barely a rules violation, if it all, since according to the OP the third player was in the act of folding as the opponent said "I have AK." Consequently, we return to the fact that this was simply a bluff--with additional audio commentary. [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]
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