Does a c-bet make sence here? KK (made up hand.)

[Jamma]

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As for him not folding the ace, villains at SSNL don't call preflop with A3o just to c/f after hitting their ace!!

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Some call preflop with A3s and dont value the ace pair much when the preflop raiser bets.

[Dan Bitel]

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As for him not folding the ace, villains at SSNL don't call preflop with A3o just to c/f after hitting their ace!!

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Some call preflop with A3s and dont value the ace pair much when the preflop raiser bets.

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yes, 0.5% of them do, thats true, but I'm more concerned about the other 99.5% and not turning my hand that has some nice showdown value and is a good bluff catcher into a complete bluff itself

[Ra_]

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Some call preflop with A3s and dont value the ace pair much when the preflop raiser bets.

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But they don't fold it either, so why build the pot for them to win.

If they bet the turn, you can call, a lot of times this bet will be less then the close to pot size be you would have made. The only difference is your one street closer to showdown. If he bets again on the river you probally have to fold, but you lost the same or less than your orginal c-bet.

If he doesn't have the ace he probably checks, and you won an extra bet.

I think your just worried about getting bluffed here when he fires the turn and river, but i think this happens rarely and if he does stuff like this regularly, just adjust when you have made hands.

[Jamma]

ok I reread OP.. "Assume villian is not so tight he folds A with a bad kicker"

In that case its almost a nobrainer not to cbet as only a better hand will call. And also those who wont ever lay down top pair are likely to lead the flop with their awesome aces, so you dont need to be so afraid of villains bets on further streets.

edit:

As everything else, what you do here will depend on your read. Is he a frequent bluffer? How much does he c/r? what's his aggression?

[K-mac]

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I bet this flop 100% of the time with KQ though. Do you see the difference?

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I am new to NL, do you think you could explain this please?
K

[Yaboosh]

KQ has very little showdown value, so your only chance to win the hand is to take it down immediately, since you beat only a complete bluff. KK on the other hand, on this board, can catch another unimproved pocket pair or simply a small piece of the board that might try to steal the pot on the turn or river after seeing you check the flop.

The problem is if dbitel only does this with KK specifically (since, presumably, he is cbetting with all aces and all nothing), it can hurt him against the rare person that actually would notice that or read this thread. But hey, that isn't that big of a problem.

[Jamma]

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I bet this flop 100% of the time with KQ though. Do you see the difference?

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I am new to NL, do you think you could explain this please?
K

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When you raise preflop, and an ace comes on the flop, your opponent who checks to you often thinks you have the ace. So you bet and he'll fold a better hand (any pair). The difference when you have a pair yourself, he will correctly fold his worse hand.

[Dan Bitel]

K-mac,

Yaboosh is spot on

[K-mac]

Thanks

[matrix]

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The problem is if dbitel only does this with KK specifically (since, presumably, he is cbetting with all aces and all nothing), it can hurt him against the rare person that actually would notice that or read this thread. But hey, that isn't that big of a problem.

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The answer to that is to cbet less often - once in a while check/fold a missed flop.

Note also that you can't do this OOP. If villain has position on you and you check the flop to him after you raised preflop most often villain will bet - now we don't know where we are whether he has an Ace or is bluffing cos you looked weak - so OOP you bet at this flop.

Another little reason that being in position is Sooooo important playing NL.