Alan Goehring on min raising - do you agree?

[registrar]

I have been educated out of min-raising (mostly)by 2+2.

However, in the home games in which my poker instincts were first honed, it used to be very profitable. You act in a slightly menacing way by raising all the time, you sweeten the pot and make it more scary dealing with 'reasonable bets' as doyle has it, you get to see a lot of flops with unreadable cards, it terrifies the table when you stack someone with having min-raised 47 pre-flop.

However, it's a style that requires two things:

1. lots of flops
2. Opponents being scared of large bets

It is not, then, a style suited to online tournament play.

[prayformojo]

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For a player who has mastered post-flop play, this seems like the way to go to me.

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When I meet such a player, I'll let him know.

[illegit]

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Preflop raising seems to be very inefficient compared to betting on other streets. When antes are not yet involved, a standard 3xbb raise means you are raising 3xbb to win 1.5xbb. How often do you raise double the pot on the flop, turn or river?

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You're not raising double the pot; you're raising the pot. you put 1 BB in to call, which makes the pot 2.5 Bbs, and raise another 2 which is slightly less than the size of the pot. A minraise is an underbet of the pot.

[locutus2002]

Wow, I think it shows that the game will accomodate many different styles.

I have never seen Alan play, but I assume he's opening alot of pots (which means he's opening light). I'd be interested how he handles PF reraises.

[GeniusToad]

a very similar strategy is advocated by Erick Lindgren in his, Making The Final Table book, from the WPT series. as others have said, a few of his main reasons for doing so are his confidence in his post flop play, his ability to disguise his hands, and the ease of letting go of the hand should a tight player come over the top.

i'd still love to hear more from Alan on the subject though.

edit: i believe Lindgren also mentions that he tends to do this early in a tournament when the blinds are small which seems to be contrary to some posts i've read earlier in the thread.

[colson10]

I read this article last night and was actually going to make a post about it myself.

I've played with Alan once before, on the bubble of the 5K Bellagio tournament that I final tabled. It was definitely an experience. This isn't meant to offend Alan, and he'd probably take it as a compliment, but if I hadn't known who he was I would have thought he was an awful player from what I saw that day.

He was also one of the more frightening players to play againt. He just seemed like a nutjob and I didn't have an idea of what he was doing.

I doubled up on him on the bubble when I defended his button min raise (blinds 1.5-3k) with A7c in the BB. The flop was AT3 with two diamonds. I checked and he bet 9k, I called. The turn was the 7d, I pushed for 50kish (he had me covered by maybe 50k) and after a long time Alan called me with KTo, no diamond.

It's a bad call if Alan knows me at all, and probably a bad call regardless, I had just recently been moved to his table. But like I said, he's a scary opponent.

It really is amazing how he accumulates a stack early in tournaments. Alan, Grinder, and a couple others. They play a ton of hands early and somehow consistently make it work. I swear the Grinder is chip leader at some point of like 50% of the tournaments he plays. WTF!

[betgo]

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It really is amazing how he accumulates a stack early in tournaments. Alan, Grinder, and a couple others. They play a ton of hands early and somehow consistently make it work. I swear the Grinder is chip leader at some point of like 50% of the tournaments he plays. WTF!


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There are a lot of weak players early on, so I can how it might be possible to accumulate chips by playing a lot of hands.

[Holdemphile]

I think if you watch the pot sizes closely in the Monte Carlo Millions you'll find the Phil Ivey uses minraises often as well, at least as the chipleader. Of course, he too is exceptional postflop. I suspect that there are many good players who use the minraise when they have a huge chiplead and are raising alot of pots.

It is probably incorrect in most situations if you have a smaller-medium size stack and are playing TAG. The LAG chipleader knows that he will have to draw out on his opponent frequently or will have to bet to win the pot so he doesn't want big pots when he is drawing or having to throw out 2/3 pot with air. Also, the blinds are more significant to a small-medium stack than a large stack so it's not as important to the chipleader to win the blinds any given hand while the shorter stacks may be at the point where they can not afford to lose many of the pots they enter.

Holdemphile

[betgo]

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I think if you watch the pot sizes closely in the Monte Carlo Millions you'll find the Phil Ivey uses minraises often as well, at least as the chipleader. Of course, he too is exceptional postflop. I suspect that there are many good players who use the minraise when they have a huge chiplead and are raising alot of pots.

It is probably incorrect in most situations if you have a smaller-medium size stack and are playing TAG. The LAG chipleader knows that he will have to draw out on his opponent frequently or will have to bet to win the pot so he doesn't want big pots when he is drawing or having to throw out 2/3 pot with air. Also, the blinds are more significant to a small-medium stack than a large stack so it's not as important to the chipleader to win the blinds any given hand while the shorter stacks may be at the point where they can not afford to lose many of the pots they enter.

Holdemphile

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I don't play in that level of event and I generally play TAG. However, when I am putting in a lot of loose raises due to a tight table and or my big stack, I like to make small raises. That way I can get away from the hand easily and it makes it harder for people to play back at me.

[Karakaz]

It is not a style suited for neither live nor online play.

Unless you force the table to accept it.