Example of why you don't call PF raises from blinds w/weak hands

Bigdaddydvo · #1 03-20-2006, 10:37 PM

Because you get trapped like this: PS WSOP Double Shootout. Calling at the end is a must since the potential existed for a busted flush draw:

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t20 (9 handed) FTR converter on zerodivide.cx

MP2 (t1750)
MP3 (t1430)
CO (t1510)
Button (t1305)
Hero (t1540)
BB (t1915)
UTG (t1470)
UTG+1 (t1300)
MP1 (t1280)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
1 fold, UTG+1 raises to t60, MP1 calls t60, 4 folds, Hero calls t50, BB calls t40.

Flop: (t240) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
Hero bets t160, BB folds, UTG+1 calls t160, MP1 folds.

Turn: (t560) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets t300, UTG+1 calls t300.

River: (t1160) 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets t300, Hero calls t300.

Final Pot: t1760

Results in white below: 
Hero has Ac Jh (two pair, jacks and fours).
UTG+1 has Ah Ad (two pair, aces and fours).
Outcome: UTG+1 wins t1760.

marchron · #2 03-21-2006, 02:51 AM

Against somebody that weak, I think I definitely call that raise with AJ. It ain't aces all the time.

Your av is awesome.

stevepa · #3 03-21-2006, 02:53 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Against somebody that weak, I think I definitely call that raise with AJ. It ain't aces all the time.

Your av is awesome.

[/ QUOTE ]

Weak? I see nothing wrong with how villain played his aces.

Steve

Bigdaddydvo · #4 03-21-2006, 07:03 AM

[ QUOTE ]
Against somebody that weak, I think I definitely call that raise with AJ. It ain't aces all the time.

Your av is awesome.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is early in the sat and I don't have a read on the villian as being weak.

MikeGuz · #5 03-21-2006, 07:16 AM

I see nothing wrong with the way either of you played the hand, perhaps UTG could have put in a prob raise on the flop.

Bigdaddydvo · #6 03-21-2006, 08:51 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I see nothing wrong with the way either of you played the hand, perhaps UTG could have put in a prob raise on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think it's basically standard on both ends if the PF raise had come from a later position since villian's hand range would have been wider, meaning my TPTK would have a greater chance of being the best hand. However, if I assign EP raising standards (assume TAG until proven otherwise) of AQs+ and TT+ my AJ is an easy muck PF.

I think the only two hands he could have based on his play is a diamond draw (like KQs) or AA. QQ or KK will raise to protect their hands from overcards on the turn.

TripDaddy · #7 03-21-2006, 11:34 AM

No problem with either of you. There is enough money in the pot to venture a call with AJ. You hit your flop. Just sucked that he had AA and he extracted maximum value from you. If he had AK, or AQ you would be a genius.

TripleNet · #8 03-21-2006, 12:32 PM

Maybe I am too tight but early in a tourny I would not make that call from an early position raiser.

jjpregler · #9 03-21-2006, 12:54 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe I am too tight but early in a tourny I would not make that call from an early position raiser.

[/ QUOTE ]

I would have probably called that. The pot odds were almost 3-1 at that point, which are favorable for an AJo.

The only thing that I may have done different (but I see the result of the hand now, I may not have been so wise at the table) would be maybe to check the turn. You made a decent sized bet after the flop which was call by the PF raiser. Not only would have AA been top, but KK and QQ post flop. It's something like 52-1 to have one of those top pairs PF, but he was representing them (as well as possible holdings like AK or AQ) and you had no information yet to determine otherwise.