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#1
10-30-2007, 06:03 PM
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An unusual view of the neo-atheists
I was previously unacquainted with Theodore Dalrymple. I found the linked article quite interesting since he take a clear shot at Dawkins, Harris, et al from the point of view of a paleo-atheist.
I can read only so much philosophy before my eyes glaze over so I'd like to hear from others their impression of Dalrymple's opinions. Dalrymple article 
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#3
10-30-2007, 06:12 PM
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Re: An unusual view of the neo-atheists
[ QUOTE ]
Can you at least summarize? :\ [/ QUOTE ] It's quite long but here is an excerpt [ QUOTE ] This sloppiness and lack of intellectual scruple, with the assumption of certainty where there is none, combined with adolescent shrillness and intolerance, reach an apogee in Sam Harris’s book The End of Faith. It is not easy to do justice to the book’s nastiness; it makes Dawkins’s claim that religious education constitutes child abuse look sane and moderate. Harris tells us, for example, that “we must find our way to a time when faith, without evidence, disgraces anyone who would claim it. Given the present state of the world, there appears to be no other future worth wanting.” I am glad that I am old enough that I shall not see the future of reason as laid down by Harris; but I am puzzled by the status of the compulsion in the first sentence that I have quoted. Is Harris writing of a historical inevitability? Of a categorical imperative? Or is he merely making a legislative proposal? This is who-will-rid-me-of-this-troublesome-priest language, ambiguous no doubt, but not open to a generous interpretation. It becomes even more sinister when considered in conjunction with the following sentences, quite possibly the most disgraceful that I have read in a book by a man posing as a rationalist: “The link between belief and behavior raises the stakes considerably. Some propositions are so dangerous that it may be ethical to kill people for believing them. This may seem an extraordinary claim, but it merely enunciates an ordinary fact about the world in which we live.” [/ QUOTE ]
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#4
10-30-2007, 06:23 PM
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Re: An unusual view of the neo-atheists
Sounds like your very classic rant vs strict empiricism, as for the book he 'reviews' I haven't read it so I can't really say if he hits the mark or not.
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#5
10-30-2007, 07:06 PM
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Re: An unusual view of the neo-atheists
Dalrymple makes his best point when he criticizes the neo-atheists' philosophical laxity. He's right: as moral philosophers, the neo-atheists are sloppy and (even worse!) shallow. The human spirit has suffered abysses darker and deeper than Dawkins et al. seem capable of imagining.
But I think it's simply because these neo-atheists are too healthy. The world makes sense to them. They see beauty and meaning everywhere. Now, we cannot blame them for wanting others to join their world! But perhaps we can blame them for not seeing that most others will be unable... Anyways, Dalrymple ruins an otherwise good article by a long series of tedious quotations, so stop reading once you get to, "I recently had occasion to compare the writings of the neo-atheists with those of Anglican divines of the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries."
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#6
10-30-2007, 07:50 PM
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Re: An unusual view of the neo-atheists
I read it. He makes some valid points, but he's supremely arrogant and I'm disgusted by his idealization of the past. It's just painful to read the mediocre writing that he quotes and then goes on about (explaining that nobody in the modern world can equal it, garbage garbage garbage).
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#7
10-30-2007, 08:27 PM
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Re: An unusual view of the neo-atheists
[ QUOTE ]
I read it. He makes some valid points, but he's supremely arrogant and I'm disgusted by his idealization of the past. It's just painful to read the mediocre writing that he quotes and then goes on about (explaining that nobody in the modern world can equal it, garbage garbage garbage). [/ QUOTE ] That was certainly the point in the article where my eyes glazed over but...Maybe his point was that even mediocre clerics had some important grasp lacking today. I dunno, I was never a good student in English.
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#8
10-30-2007, 08:34 PM
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Re: An unusual view of the neo-atheists
[ QUOTE ]
I read it. He makes some valid points, but he's supremely arrogant and I'm disgusted by his idealization of the past. It's just painful to read the mediocre writing that he quotes and then goes on about (explaining that nobody in the modern world can equal it, garbage garbage garbage). [/ QUOTE ] I rather pity people who can't/don't understand "the Intentional Stance". luckyme
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#9
10-30-2007, 09:05 PM
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Re: An unusual view of the neo-atheists
I almost forgot he was an atheist after reading it. A lot to think about. I failed to detect any outrageous arrogance like others in this thread did.
What he said about moderation is particularly salutory in view of the extremes of cruelty and gross material excesses of the 20th century.
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#10
10-30-2007, 09:27 PM
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Re: An unusual view of the neo-atheists
[ QUOTE ]
I almost forgot he was an atheist after reading it. A lot to think about. I failed to detect any outrageous arrogance like others in this thread did. What he said about moderation is particularly salutory in view of the extremes of cruelty and gross material excesses of the 20th century. [/ QUOTE ] Gross material excesses of the 20th century? Have you ever been to Giza? Maybe seen the Sun Palace?
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