PLO25... I need help getting aggressive

OrrLives · #1 10-20-2007, 06:01 AM

Villain unknown. I felt that I played this hand too loosely and passively and it made me sick. I am usually a ~25/12 player.

PokerStars Pot-Limit Omaha High, $0.25 BB (5 handed)

Hero ($24.20) - button
SB ($19.10)
BB ($32.80)
UTG ($13.45)
MP ($17.85)

Preflop: Hero is Button with 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
UTG calls $0.25, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.25, SB completes, BB checks.

Is this an automatic raise on the button? Pot raise? I will raise with this type of hand sometimes on the button.

Flop: ($1) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB bets $0.95, BB folds, UTG folds, Hero calls $0.95.

Most villains will not bet out here from the SB unless they have at least top two pair. I put him on a pretty big hand. It is possible he has a straight and inferior flush draw too, but I would give more weight to villain having two pair or better.

I have middle pair,nut flush draw and a gutshot. If I knew the villain was super aggressive, I would raise here. Against an unknown, I usually just call. Raising pot at PLO25 is probably not going to get top two pair to fold.

Turn: ($2.90) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img](2 players)
SB bets $2.8, Hero calls $2.80.

Uh oh, I have trips but I've put villain on top two or better on the flop and there is a good chance he has filled up. If he had a draw there is a good chance he would slow down here, but he bet the pot. Does this become an automatic fold? Would anyone raise here?

River: ($8.50) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets $8.1, Hero calls $8.10.

I can't explain this call. I think it was pretty donkish, but I somehow made it. In retrospect, I don't think I would be ahead 33% of the time (the % needed to be an even money).

Final Pot: $24.70

Results in white below:
<font color="white">
SB has Kh 3s 8s Qd (two pair, kings and tens).
Outcome: Hero wins $24.70. </font>

thisnamedoesntfi · #2 10-20-2007, 07:34 AM

[ QUOTE ]

Uh oh, I have trips but I've put villain on top two or better on the flop and there is a good chance he has filled up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Here's your problem. You have a very good hand, and with only his pot sized stab at the flop, you have him defined. If you put him on two pair at this point.....

http://twodimes.net/h/?z=3816337
pokenum -o 9s ac tc 6s - kd ts qh 9h -- kc 8c td
Omaha Hi: 820 enumerated boards containing Kc 8c Td
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
9s 6s Ac Tc 436 53.17 378 46.10 6 0.73 0.535
Ts Kd Qh 9h 378 46.10 436 53.17 6 0.73 0.465

Why do you need top two to fold. If he has that much.

RoundTower · #3 10-20-2007, 07:47 AM

I would probably call the turn and fold the river. With the read you give you can fold the turn, if you trust your read.

Elrazor · #4 10-20-2007, 08:39 AM

i definatly raise this hand pre flop with position, this makes the flop a much tougher proposition for utg if he wants to take a stab. As played i probably play the hand the same as you except i woud fold the river unless i had a solid read, which it looks like you had

OrrLives · #5 10-20-2007, 10:14 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

Uh oh, I have trips but I've put villain on top two or better on the flop and there is a good chance he has filled up.

[/ QUOTE ]

Here's your problem. You have a very good hand, and with only his pot sized stab at the flop, you have him defined. If you put him on two pair at this point.....

http://twodimes.net/h/?z=3816337
pokenum -o 9s ac tc 6s - kd ts qh 9h -- kc 8c td
Omaha Hi: 820 enumerated boards containing Kc 8c Td
cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
9s 6s Ac Tc 436 53.17 378 46.10 6 0.73 0.535
Ts Kd Qh 9h 378 46.10 436 53.17 6 0.73 0.465

Why do you need top two to fold. If he has that much.

[/ QUOTE ]

On the turn top two becomes a full house. There is no way I'm folding this on the flop.

thisnamedoesntfi · #6 10-20-2007, 10:43 PM

You said raising pot would not get top two to fold on the flop. I was asking why you want top two to necessarily fold.

I think it's odd that your "solid" read was top two into boat on the turn and you called it down anyway. If you really put him on that hand as you say, then it should be an easy fold on the turn.

OrrLives · #7 10-20-2007, 10:52 PM

[ QUOTE ]
You said raising pot would not get top two to fold on the flop. I was asking why you want top two to necessarily fold.

I think it's odd that your "solid" read was top two into boat on the turn and you called it down anyway. If you really put him on that hand as you say, then it should be an easy fold on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Read the OP... where did I ever say I had a 'solid' read? I said that most players would only bet out OOP on the flop into a multiway pot with top two or better. On the flop I had a decent hand but could very well be behind (against a set for example). If I KNEW he had two pair + no flush draw I would pot it.

I made a call on the turn because I felt that I had a pretty decent hand, but it would very well not be good. I wasn't sure and would reevaluate on the river. My river call was probably terrible most of the time.

I just wanted to see what others thought of my hand.

thisnamedoesntfi · #8 10-21-2007, 04:31 AM

I don't think there is anything wrong with the hand other than your thought process as you describe it. If you think you should fold, but you call, that's what needs work.

Personally, with the nut FD on the flop and trips/TK on the turn, I'm not folding this against an unknown, so I like the call on the river.

OrrLives · #9 10-21-2007, 04:44 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think there is anything wrong with the hand other than your thought process as you describe it. If you think you should fold, but you call, that's what needs work.

Personally, with the nut FD on the flop and trips/TK on the turn, I'm not folding this against an unknown, so I like the call on the river.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree that my thought process versus my actions was completely wrong. I probably just decided I was in too deep and called him down.

For the future...
Against an unknown what type of hands would you put him on after he pot bets into a multiway pot OOP?
After the turn POT bet?
River pot bet?

thisnamedoesntfi · #10 10-21-2007, 05:01 AM

The one thing I would do in this hand is raise the turn if I didn't raise the flop.

If I'm just calling his PSB on every street I put him on a worse hand than me, so if I think he "may" have a boat on the turn, I'm raising or folding every time.