100NL HU: top set in 4bet pot

overun · #1 09-24-2007, 01:48 PM

Hero and villain have been getting rather aggressive. Lots of preflop raise/fold, mixed in w/ some preflop/raise/reraise/folds.

One hand, hero raises to 3 in SB with Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], villain reraises to 8 in BB. Flop comes out Q high, villain leads, hero raises, villain pushes, hero calls and villain shows JJ, hero's hand is good.

Finally, this hand comes up.

Effective stacks of about 250.

Villain raises preflop to 3. Hero reraises to 10 with T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. Villain reraises to 34. Hero calls.

Flop ($68) comes out T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
Hero??

Both have about 215 behind.

What's the most optimal line here?

ManChild · #2 09-24-2007, 02:07 PM

i think you can probably lead here, but c/r ing is also good

chiTown22 · #3 09-24-2007, 02:25 PM

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i think you can probably lead here, but c/r ing is also good

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I believe hero is in pos.

I think c-betting is your best line. If you check behind on flop it will be a red flag due to your history.

If he leads I would flat call and bet turn if checked to.

chris269 · #4 09-24-2007, 02:29 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i think you can probably lead here, but c/r ing is also good

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I believe hero is in pos.

I think c-betting is your best line. If you check behind on flop it will be a red flag due to your history.

If he leads I would flat call and bet turn if checked to.

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Hero is first to act.

I would lead to get a raise and finally get commited. If you c/r he MIGHT get away from his AK.

chiTown22 · #5 09-24-2007, 02:57 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
i think you can probably lead here, but c/r ing is also good

[/ QUOTE ]
I believe hero is in pos.

I think c-betting is your best line. If you check behind on flop it will be a red flag due to your history.

If he leads I would flat call and bet turn if checked to.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hero is first to act.

I would lead to get a raise and finally get commited. If you c/r he MIGHT get away from his AK.

[/ QUOTE ]
In that case, I really don't like the flat call preflop. What is the plan there? You can't call for set value.

What is your plan for the flop, check/fold over card flop and stack off on unders?

OOP I think you need to shove preflop or fold.

orange · #6 09-24-2007, 03:00 PM

c shove flop

cjp010 · #7 09-24-2007, 03:00 PM

You might not be as far ahead as you think so instead of a free card i'd c-bet it big hoping for either a folder or C/R and get it in before he peals.

Bluegrassplayer · #8 09-24-2007, 03:03 PM

What if the flop was A/K/x or A/Q/x? You could get away from 10s then. I like his call preflop personally, it gets him out of a horserace and lets him try to hit a set for a big pay out as well. I also think he HAS position here in some ways. It's very likely that the other player would make a continuation bet regardless of the flop, so this way the 10s can bet out first and try to get a fold from the other play when a favorable flop comes. If a poor one comes out, he chalks up his losses and folds.

Pushing with 10s is a little strong, and folding for 2 to 1 odds preflop is way weak.

chiTown22 · #9 09-24-2007, 03:06 PM

[ QUOTE ]
What if the flop was A/K/x or A/Q/x? You could get away from 10s then. I like his call preflop personally, it gets him out of a horserace and lets him try to hit a set for a big pay out as well. I also think he HAS position here in some ways. It's very likely that the other player would make a continuation bet regardless of the flop, so this way the 10s can bet out first and try to get a fold from the other play when a favorable flop comes. If a poor one comes out, he chalks up his losses and folds.

Pushing with 10s is a little strong, and folding for 2 to 1 odds preflop is way weak.

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Every flop that does not contain a T is a poor flop. So, ~80% of the flops are going to be poor flops. Flat calling oop with TT in a 4bet pot is waaayyy -EV.

Bluegrassplayer · #10 09-24-2007, 03:09 PM

Hmmm. I don't know if everyone flop not containing a 10 is a poor flop. What if the flop is something like J/under/under or Q/under/under. 10s are most likely good right now, and if there is only one over on the board, especially if it's not an ace, then they are likely to be good on the flop. Thats where your reading skills have to come into play, of course he is out of position for that. I think there are a lot of favorable flops that could come out here. I find myself in this position a lot though, so I'd like to hear if other people agree with you, I feel like I might misplay 10s pretty consistently.