QQ in SB vs OC Galore

JohnMo · #1 09-02-2007, 05:09 PM

No reads, as I post this, I still only have 20 hands with Vil. When should I give up here if at all.

Poker Stars
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $0.50/$1
10 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (10 players) Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
UTG calls, 8 folds, 8 folds, Hero raises, UTG calls.

Flop: 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (4.5SB, 2 players)
Hero bets, UTG calls.

Turn: K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3.25BB, 2 players)
Hero bets, UTG calls.
I planned a R/F here

River: J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5.25BB, 2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets, Hero folds.
Uncalled bets: 1BB returned to UTG.

Results:
Final pot: 5.25BB

sean c · #2 09-02-2007, 05:20 PM

I bet/fold the river against an unknown but check/folding is plan b.

Xylocain · #3 09-02-2007, 06:15 PM

B/f this river is terrible. Do you really think J5o is calling or A6 is folding?

c/c is OK if Vil is ever bluffing, c/f is not a big mistake.

sharpie · #4 09-02-2007, 06:22 PM

[ QUOTE ]
B/f this river is terrible. Do you really think J5o is calling or A6 is folding?

c/c is OK if Vil is ever bluffing, c/f is not a big mistake.

[/ QUOTE ]

c/c is the worse of all options. If villain got to the river with any pair, he's probably calling, and definitely is calling with them more than he's betting.

Still, I would c/f unless your average unknown will turn his low pair into a bluff.

Xylocain · #5 09-02-2007, 06:23 PM

It doesnt matter if he he is calling more than he is betting if he is beating us with his calling range. Checking may induce a bluff.

Point is: [i]folding a hand we beat is not a reason to bet

Landonfan · #6 09-02-2007, 07:56 PM

Grunch.

Looks okay against an unknown. Lots of players will call that flop with 9x/underpair. Once he bets the river, it looks like he has a bad ace, but I think I call anyway just in case (i.e., because I'm a station), then make a note. But if you're calling the river, you're better off b/f'ing.

milesdyson · #7 09-02-2007, 08:02 PM

[ QUOTE ]
It doesnt matter if he he is calling more than he is betting if he is beating us with his calling range. Checking may induce a bluff.

Point is: folding a hand we beat is not a reason to bet

[/ QUOTE ]
he can't bluff. what did he do call no pair no draw to the river?

Landonfan · #8 09-02-2007, 08:08 PM

[ QUOTE ]
It doesnt matter if he he is calling more than he is betting if he is beating us with his calling range. Checking may induce a bluff.

Point is: folding a hand we beat is not a reason to bet

[/ QUOTE ]
Against an unknown at .5/1, a good guess at his calling range is aces (we can probably discount AK, AQ, and maybe AJ), nines (probably like 96s+), underpairs, and maybe fours. That's wide enough that I like a b/f here. I admit it's thin, but I want to get to showdown and a b/f is the best way to do that.

Also, we induce a bluff here almost never, unless he decides to turn his midpair into a bluff, which few players at this limit will do.

KitCloudkicker · #9 09-02-2007, 08:17 PM

all streets look good.

b/f is good too. and c/c is def awful.

Xylocain · #10 09-02-2007, 08:50 PM

Anyone who thinks Vil is bluff calling 55 or 9T >55% of the time or thinks they are folding an Ace that called flop and turn can go ahead and b/f. No matter how I look at it this is at least 0.5BB/100 mistake.

The bet when checked crowd would bet 55 on the river, but not call with it on this board. There is no reason to think an unknown is retarded enough to put you on Q8 which is the only hand someone holding a PP beat.