PS $3 - 99 UTG with UTG+1 caller

Yoda82 · #1 07-23-2007, 06:17 PM

Hi all, first post after many months of lurking

Villain moved to table 4 hands ago, so no reads at all. What to do on the flop?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t1000 (9 handed) internettexasholdem.com

BB (t32592)
Hero (t17618)
UTG+1 (t32052)
MP1 (t21597)
MP2 (t33718)
MP3 (t13136)
CO (t17898)
Button (t9034)
SB (t13616)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
Hero raises to t3000, UTG+1 calls t3000, 7 folds.

Flop: (t6800) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero........

Very good flop for 99, but the position of the caller concerned me. Pushing seems bad here as I very rarely get called by worse hands, or make better hands fold (maybe TT?) I was inclined to bet small here to keep worse hands from folding with the intention of pushing most turns.

Thoughts....?

owler · #2 07-23-2007, 06:29 PM

i think you must bet between 1/2 and 2/3 pot, maybe go allin because if you bet flop and an overcard comes, it will be hard to fold cause you are kind of comited i think.

tough spot

bet flop,shove turn > shove flop or other way around?

Yoda82 · #3 07-23-2007, 07:24 PM

I don't like pushing here as he can easily fold AK, AQ etc. I wasn't intending to fold to a raise which is why I liked the idea of a small bet - if I do this he might push worse hands, or call then fold the turn. Shoving the flop should only get called by TT+.

There is the chance of an overcard, but even then it probably doesn't help him (and I was intending to push the turn...)

SuperUberBob · #4 07-23-2007, 07:58 PM

If you've been playing pretty tight, I definitely bet out here. You didn't play this hand just to give up the pot on a flop like this. C-bet and if you're raised, you're likely facing a higher pair of AKdd

hamnegger · #5 07-23-2007, 09:48 PM

bet out fold to raise!if called eesh

Yoda82 · #6 07-24-2007, 12:36 PM

Villain moved to table 4 hands before - he has no idea what I play like.

If I did have a read check-raising is good if he bets all hands when checked to, but I don't know that.

I went with the small bet hoping he might push AK, 66 etc (or call then fold the turn). If I bet $6k these hands are much more likely to fold, and also leaves me very shortstacked. Of course things are never that simple....

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t1000 (9 handed) internettexasholdem.com

BB (t32592)
Hero (t17618)
UTG+1 (t32052)
MP1 (t21597)
MP2 (t33718)
MP3 (t13136)
CO (t17898)
Button (t9034)
SB (t13616)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
Hero raises to t3000, UTG+1 calls t3000, 7 folds.

Flop: (t6800) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets t4000, UTG+1 calls t4000.

Turn: (t14800) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 bets t11000, Hero folds.

Final Pot: t25800

Not what I was hoping for, as I'm now behind more often. is check/fold the only option, or would anyone push the turn?

SuperUberBob · #7 07-24-2007, 02:12 PM

Ick. I might fold this here. I really don't want to raise and end up playing this out of position with your stack size. But at the same time, I really don't want to shove a deep stack here from UTG.

As played preflop, everything else is standard.

IMO

Folding > Shoving >>> Raising >>>>>>>>>>>>&g t;>>>>>>>>> Limping

b-komplex · #8 07-24-2007, 02:22 PM

I think I would shove the turn since the Ad dropped I don't think he ever has an ace here and you very well could have one in his mind.

Yoda82 · #9 07-24-2007, 02:54 PM

I think he can have an Ace here some of the time, at the time I was worried about the flush, I only realised later it was very unlikely, as he can't have Ad in his hand so should not have a flush here often.

I think I'm behind too often here, so check/folded.

Bob: You really think open folding 99 here is the best play? I think it's far too strong to fold here. Small pairs are probably a fold, but 99?

IMO: raising >>> limping (can limp/push sometimes) >>>>>>>>>>>>&g t;>>>>>>>>>>>&gt ; open pushing/folding - I would never want to do either of these

BarryLyndon · #10 07-24-2007, 03:26 PM

First, a limp here is very advisable. Stacks, your position, your M, make limp here nice. There are things you can do with the limp depending on who raises / situation.

The flop, to me, is a push. What more could you want from our of a flop? UTG+1 has a very large stack and is going float you more often than not; you shouldn't fear pushing for a 7K pot here. You get 88 in a lot, maybe 77 as well. And yes, you WANT to fold out AQ / AJ here, please, this pot is now about 40% of your stack. yes?

As played, turn is a monsterously difficult decision which you shouldn't have to deal with. Do I think villain's range includes an AQ float? probably not AK float? AK RRs preflop. Do I think that villain may think the "A" scared you? What will betting do here? Betting may fold out 1010, but prob. not folding out JJ, and QQ+ RRs here. 88 folds, so does 77 now. All things said, you have to push, because folding out 1010 and maaaaaaaaaaayyyyybe JJ is too valuable here.

Barry