$4/180 - BvB. I triple barrel. spew?

[woohoo88]

<font color="blue">Just moved to this table four hands ago. First hand I've played at the table. No history with villan. 30 players remaining (18 pay).</font>

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t300 (8 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Button (t5850)
Hero (t17285)
BB (t8360)
UTG (t9990)
UTG+1 (t7945)
MP1 (t9115)
MP2 (t3380)
CO (t3695)

Preflop: Hero is SB with J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">6 folds</font>, Hero completes, BB checks.

Flop: (t625) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets t600</font>, BB calls t600.

Turn: (t1825) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets t1300</font>, BB calls t1300.

River: (t4425) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">Hero bets t3000</font>

<font color="blue">Villain called flop/turn INSTANTLY. My thinking is that draws make up a big portion of villain's range (especially w/ the timing tell). Since only 56, which is less likely due to me having a 6, gets there I figured he's folding most of his range on the river.</font>

[levAA]

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Villain called flop/turn INSTANTLY.

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Just moved to this table four hands ago. First hand I've played at the table. No history with villan.

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don't understand this
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Flop: like it
Turn: bet size is too large - you can get the same information cheaper
River: Don't like the bet here, specially not the bet-size, some kind of defensive bet about 1000 would be ok. if you didn't chase him of until now its hard to represent you held an ace all the time - so if he got anything he will look you up, if he was on a flush draw, he will fold anyway also to a much smaller bet.

[woohoo88]

levAA,

I assume you're referring to the timing tell w/o having played a hand vs villain. This is a pretty common tell from what I've experienced/read. Although obviously not something you want to rely on completely.

The turn bet is not for information. It's a bluff. I'm not sure anything less would have the same amount of FE, but given the instacall of the PSB on the flop I suppose it's possible.

The river I actually agree could have been more like 2000-2500. That came to mind when going over this hand.

[levAA]

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The turn bet is not for information. It's a bluff.

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you have an open ended straight draw - so i would say this is basically a semi-bluff.
i think there are 2 possible ways to play this on the turn - either make a smaller bet - something like half the pot (if you say he is always calling the flop - then you need information if he really hit anything) or shove it in (if you want to play it as a semibluff) and put him on a hard decision (you got outs enough).

[cheburashka]

My usual caveat about how I'm new and suck at this game...

On the flop and the turn, where you are semi-bluffing, I agree with lev that you could have saved yourself 1k and accomplished the same thing (information, getting villain to fold) with two 50% bets instead of bets of 100% and 70% (in fact, you might have appeared a bit stronger on the turn, as your actual turn bet as a % of the pot went down, which I would interpret as weakness).

As for the river bet, I do this all the time (yesterday, in fact), and I suspect it's a huge leak. I think not making a river bet sends an engraved invitation to villain to make a huge bet, and the pot is gone (and I'm very worried that a pretty large share of the time gone to a bluff). On the other hand, if villain has called substantial bets on the flop and turn with that board, he's very unlikely to go away on the river. And let's face it, there are an awful lot of hands he could have that explain his betting (77+, 2 pair, A7-9, K7-9, etc.) I think a busted draw is less likely, since you've given him horrible odds to draw, and he has played anyway.

Could we think about this the following way: Suppose villain calls and beats us 2/3 of the time and will fold with a busted draw 1/3 of the time. If our river bet is 50% of the pot, then we exactly break even. So if we think the likelihood of a call is &gt;2/3 (which I think it probably is, given his betting so far), then we lose.

But in any case, if you were to stick with 50% bets the whole way through to the river, you'd be 2.2K ahead with, I would argue, exactly the same result.

[woohoo88]

cheburashka,

FWIW I make the same flop/turn bet sizes with two pair/set type hands. The reason being implied odds play a bigger role when the pot is smaller, such as on the flop. So that it's necessary to make a bigger bet to cut down on the implied odds your opponent is getting. The turn, however, is a bigger pot which means implied odds aren't as big of a factor.

Not that I'm necessarily advocating using the same bet sizing for some metagame type reasons or anything. At this level there is hardly, if any, metagame. Though I'm very quick to make note of someone using smaller bets when drawing/weak/etc.

[Cornell Fiji]

I have not read any responses. I want to add a disclaimer that I don't know how the typical villain plays in a 4.40.


Fold preflop. You have crap. It is foolish to play this out of position. If you insist on playing it then you should raise but in reality this should always be a fold.

On the flop your bet is fine.

I would go for a check-shove on the turn since nothing has changed so he will be calling the turn with whatever he called the flop with (unless he was floating). You also don't mind if the turn checks through.

I shove the river. Put him to a decision for his tournament life when he is not likely to have an ace.