Xpost - 3bet KK pf oop on an Axx board.

[Jay Riall]

Party Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $1/$2 Blinds - 5 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

SB: $122.98
Hero (BB): $461.29
UTG: $207.00
CO: $200.00
BTN: $200.00

Preflop: Hero is dealt K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 Players)
2 folds, <font color="red">BTN raises to $7.00</font>, SB calls $6.00, <font color="red">Hero raises to $33.00</font>, BTN calls $26.00, SB folds

Flop: ($73) A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, BTN checks

Turn: ($73) 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">BTN bets $55.00</font>, Hero calls $55.00

River: ($183) T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">BTN bets all-in for $112.00</font>, Hero folds

Sorry for posting an SSNL hand here, but I wasn't really satisfied with the replies SSNL gave me, and I think its a fairly close spot readless. With a read this obv becomes pretty easy, but I don't have one, save that the villain seems kinda TAGgy over a very small sample. Who bets the flop here then gives up UI? Checks flop but bets turn? Who takes my line?

[1o BoY]

if your willing to call the turn then we should be betting it for info for the same ammount, no draws only a better hand will call....

[mak15]

[ QUOTE ]
if your willing to call the turn then we should be betting it for info for the same ammount, no draws only a better hand will call....

[/ QUOTE ]

this is not true. if only better hands will call, betting is obviously bad.

[john kane]

i havent read the other thread, but if he is solid tag he shouldnt be calling $26 pf with a pocket pair, thus he should have AK or AA (edit or Ajs, AQ, QKs, you know the standard range).

if he is calling with a pocket pair, then he checks river behind.

if he has called with suited connectors, he has either 67 for two pair (but should bet flop), 89 for the straight, 34 or 45 for nothing, or any other hand he likely checks behind on river (e.g. 56s).

i think its a pretty easy fold, given all you are beating is missed suited connectors if we assume he checks behind with a non-A pair.

sure you can say whether he reraises AA or AK, but it's not out of the question.

he may be calling pf with a pocket pair to show he wont be bossed around and getting 8 to 1 isnt that bad for a call with pp pf esp with position, so he could have 66, 77.

as you say, you need a read to define his calling range pf, once youve done that you can obv make a decision on what to do, as in a situation like this, i think it is very much opponent dependent (like most hands in poker)

edit: QK, JQ may fire again, but i dont know many who would fire again in a reraiser pf who has check-called an A board.

[Dan BRIGHT]

heh this thread is a disaster

[john kane]

also, i know you know this, but so many people do not re-state enough times in their head why you actually raise preflop (becuase you think you have a better hand, in this case, or the opponent will think you have a better hand in which case he folds). here you are obv raising for the former reason, however, you have had the flop situation you didnt want (after all you would be far less likely to rr pf with KK if you knew and A would flop), but yet you are still happy to check-call for your entire stack; looks like you failed to fold a hand which you raised for value and instead are now blindly check-calling (i.e. never decreasing his hand range) only getting odds by the amount put in previously in the hand due to your raise preflop, which has turned into effectively a failed +preflopev gamble.

[rsliu]

against an unknown this looks like a pretty simple laydown

[Jay Riall]

[ QUOTE ]
against an unknown this looks like a pretty simple laydown

[/ QUOTE ]

The question is more to do with the flop/turn line tbh.

[Jay Riall]

[ QUOTE ]
heh this thread is a disaster

[/ QUOTE ]

You like my lin Dan? No needot give reasoning if you don't wana.

[rsliu]

unless you slowplay AK in these spots your line pretty much flips your hand over as a pair that is scared of that ace. If I'm villain and I think you're capable of making a tough laydown (which it looks like you're not) I push river with any two.