Getting the most from a great flop

[KaatzMeow]

When I hit the flop hard whether it be sets or 2 pair, I almost never slow play them since a raise on the turn sets off warning signals in lots of players minds. Many times I get another player in with me that also hit the flop and my quandry is whether to re-raise or cap on the flop because it seems that on the turn, my opponents really slow down (as well they should). The following is what I think a typical hand I have trouble with betting. This hand is a 2-pair hand but I have hands with sets that have a similar line. Usually the hands are 3 or even 4 handed.

Hero in BB with 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
Villain 1 55.17/3.45/.61 for less than 75 hands UTG+1
Villain 2 76.92/3.85/1.36 for less than 50 hands MP2


V1 calls, V2 calls, Hero checks


Flop: 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]


Hero bets, V1 calls, V2 raises, Hero?

I have almost always re-raised here and then usually 1 villain calls so I get the same number of bets in the post with 1 fewer opponent which is a good thing. Usually with these hands I want more opponents since I have a hand that will usually hold up. Then on the the turn the 1 remaining player checks and calls the Turn and often folds the River.

If I just call the raise then I can bet/3 bet the Turn and get an extra 1.5 BB but then I have 2 opponents. What are your opinions on this.

I am talking about hands that one is pretty sure that they will hold up.

[bennyhana]

It would be easier to get fancy if the flop was
8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

On your flop, you need to get out your raising rock.

[NIX]

Threeway or fourway, I pretty much play straightforward. In this case, V1 sucks and looks like he's gonna peel flops lightly and probably call down lightly. V2 also sucks, but is more agro.

I really like two pair at this point so I'd just raise. V1 is probably gonna call the flop and maybe fold the turn with air or pay you off if he has a hand. V2 might do the same and may even cap with a strong queen.

[Bona]

The various situations you describe can't really be lumped together or played the same way. This particular hand is kind of a dangerous spot. You are probably ahead so that calls for a raise but there is a lot of negative potential ahead. V1 is likely drawing so you need to charge him for that. A heart turn is quite ugly. V2 is likely drawing, maybe has TPdecentK and doesn't know he is drawing. There are lots of cards that can hurt you on the turn because your bottom 2 pair are very vulnerable to being counterfeited. I raise this and proceed cautiously on the turn remembering any card that looks like a brick to me could hit the villains other hole card and make his 2 pair bigger. Also remembering we do have 4 outs to a very good hand.

[McNeese72]

With the flush draw out there, I'm playing this fast and reraising to try to, at least, get rid of the other villain.

[marchron]

[ QUOTE ]
When I hit the flop hard whether it be sets or 2 pair

[/ QUOTE ]
Sets are a lot different than two pair. You can think about slowplaying a set if the circumstances are right. You should very rarely slowplay two pair, especially bottom two, especially bottom two on a wet board. If that makes them slow down on the turn, so be it; you don't have enough of a hand to let them do anything else.

[bravos1]

just bet and raise flopped monsters... the end

[jeanbaptiste36]

With bottom 2 try to bring the pot home immediatly. Your hand can be counterfeited.

[Buzz-cp]

well I wouldn't call this a monster, as we can get counterfeit sometimes by the river. I still 3-bet.

edited to add that if it went: hero bets, V1 raises, V2 3-bets ... Hero calls and waits for a safe turn card.

[Thomas Newton]

This is a very vulnerable hand, bet, raise and pray (to quote a reg).

Generally, real monsters are so rare you can make big mistakes and it doesn't really matter. See Royal Flush example from the opening of SSH.

Bravos has the advice, bet and raise.