10$: Tight is right, but when is it too tight?

[DonLigretto]

Hi

Sometimes I wonder if I just play too tight in these SNGs. I really hardly play any hand until it's 6 handed and/or the blinds are at 50/100. Unless of course I get a hand like QQ+ or AK which I raise pf, and I limp with PP's as well as AQ and AJ (only in LP). Now here are two hands, Hand 1 I might have played too tight. What about hand 2? Fold when he reraised or is KK pf never a fold?

Hand 1
Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Tournament
Blinds: t15/t30
8 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: t1500
UTG+1: t1500
MP1: t1500
MP2: t3045
CO: t1455
DonLigretto: t1455
SB: t1545
BB: t1500

Pre-flop: (8 players) DonLigretto is Button with T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
3 folds, <font color="#cc0000">MP2 raises to t105</font>, CO folds, DonLigretto folds, 2 folds.
Uncalled bets: t75 returned to MP2.

Results:
Final pot: t75

Hand 2 I didn't play this one tight though. KK is never a fold pf right?
Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Tournament
Blinds: t20/t40
8 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: t1455
UTG+1: t1780
MP1: t3240
MP2: t1725
DonLigretto: t1395
Button: t1490
SB: t1250
BB: t1165

Pre-flop: (8 players) DonLigretto is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
2 folds, <font color="#cc0000">MP1 raises to t140</font>, MP2 folds, <font color="#cc0000">DonLigretto raises to t420</font>, 3 folds, <font color="#cc0000">MP1 raises all-in t3240</font>, <font color="#cc0000">DonLigretto calls all-in t975</font>.
Uncalled bets: t1845 returned to MP1.

Flop: 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (t120, 0 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: t2850)


Turn: J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (t120, 0 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: t2850)


River: 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (t120, 0 player + 2 all-in - Main pot: t2850)


Results:
Final pot: t120
<font color="#ffffff">DonLigretto showed Kd Ks</font>
<font color="#ffffff">MP1 showed Ah Ad</font>

[Stevens65]

hand 1) I call with position and revaluate on the flop
hand 2) this is not a situation where you fold KK. maybe in a special bubble situation when one villain has 1 chip left you can fold KK.

[DonLigretto]

About hand 1: I called sometimes in a Situation like that and a flop like 583 comes. What do you do then? Play it agressive and if necessary for all your chips? Because usually the big stacks at these limits play TP high kicker (or sometimes if it's a maniac any kicker) like the nuts.

[jesse8888]

I posted "Going to War with KK preflop" about a week ago. The consensus was that you can't ever fold KK preflop (someone even gave a good "Green Eggs and Ham" style rendition of when to not fold them) in a low stakes SNG.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showfl...ue#Post10864688

As for the first hand, I agree with a call and re-evaluate on the flop.

[DonLigretto]

Ok about KK we all agree [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] But what about hand 1 in Situation a) an overcard comes, and b) all lowercards rainbow come?

[Stevens65]

hand 2 depends on villain's action on the flop. If he checks I usually bet. If villain cbets I often reraise and probably fold to a push.

[Pocketbear]

Definitely calling in hand #1. It's for 7% of your stack only so you can even play it for set value, but usually yeah, playing on low flop like Stevens65 said.

Hand #2 is easy shove. Even if the villain repushes with KK+,AK you're on the coinflip and if the villain repushes only with QQ+,AK you're 57/43 favorite.

[fraz8000]

[ QUOTE ]
Definitely calling in hand #1. It's for 7% of your stack only so you can even play it for set value,

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you saying that everytime we hit our set we will stack our opponent? Thats basically the only way that playing TT here for just set value would be mathematically correct... Playing for (set/undercard flop/ position bet on flop) value makes it close, but i'm still folding TT here. Keep in mind though i play real tight early on due to multitabling. I just don't like this spot because the majority of the time an overcard will come on the flop, all of which conceivably could hit his raising range from his spot (AJ+ as just one example). You having position on him means you can't lead at him, which is actually a real disadvantage because chances are he cont-bets, and you find yourself in a really bad spot (unless you are lucky enough to hit your set/ all undercards come on flop). I try to steer clear of these tough spots so early in a stt.

I'm not folding the KK hand at a $10 stt though- not without a very, very confident read/stats(and even then probably not :P).

[simonpoker]

I think its fine to fold TT you wont stack your opponent everytime

[PorkchopDJG]

Hand #2 is an easy push preflop, if he has AA oh well move on.

Hand #1 I definitely call in position and re-evaluate after the flop. If no T and overcards come and he bets easy fold. If no T and no overcards and he bets large amount I probably fold as well but if he bets a small amount I may call or put in a little raise to see where he is at. If he calls that raise or re-raises I'm done.

I had a hand similiar to this in a $20 SNG last night. I called with TT on the button when he raised UTG to like 100 with a 30 BB. Flop came all small rainbow. He bet $50, I called. Brick turn he bets $50, again I called. River paired a 5 on the board he bet $400, I folded and he showed KK.