River Raise

[James.]

i'm in the BB with A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. i look like an ubernit.

15/12/1.9 UTG+1 limps, 22/4/1.2 MP calls, a 38/16/2.5 CO raises, an unknown sb semicoldcalls, i call in the BB, all call.

Flop(10sb): 3 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

sb checks, i check, UTG+1 bets, MP folds, CO raises, sb folds, i 3bet, all call.

Turn(8.5bb): 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

i check, UTG+1 bets, CO calls, i call.

River(10.5bb): T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

i check, UTG+1 checks, CO bets, i checkraise...

[atnels]

I don't hate it, but did you consider the same play on the turn after CO folded and you picked up the gutshot?

[shane88888]

I think your line is so odd you get a curiosity call every time, or at least more than risking two bets to win 11.5 is worth.

[atnels]

UTG looks slighty tight preflop. So you figure his range is probably 77+. No preflop reraise; so probably AA-JJ are out. He bet into the pfr, so I figure you can narrow his range down to 77-TT, KQh, KJh, and KTh. Of course, there could be some weird stuff but if he was on a pure bluff with overs he would have probably folded when it was two cold back to him.

Betting the turn into two raisers says to me that he's got something worth calling your c/r on the river.

[Aces McGee]

I could be completely missing your intention here, but I'd like this a lot more with you holding something like 8c5c and the river being the Th.

-McGee

[*TT*]

smells too much like you missed, its unbelievable. If I'm UTG I'm looking you up with many decent hands. But I am not UTG, tell us more than his stats.

[jstill]

its almost never correct to cr bluff someone after they vb. hes shown quite a bit of strength as well.

if u think hes capable/ likely to bet something like a pairless fd on the turn or 98 or T8 T9 (if hed call 2 back cold on the flop with those, possible) becuz u check when hes sandwiched in the middle 3 way vs the flop ck raiser and ck 3bettor (most wont) then this is still an awful river cuz all the straights hit (and wont fold top pair to ur cr). But if u think he has worse flushes enuff just call those are the only hands that fodl to ur cr, and then ur odds to win are only 11:1 instead of 11:2. I really think the extra bb investment, really only folds hands u beat so its basically burning money, or at least doesnt fold out enough better hands often enough to make it worth the additional investment. Really though I dont think this is even worth a ck call becuz of the way he played his hand (calling 2 cold on the flop and betting the turn 3 ways when u ck into the flop cr'er and ck 3bettor), so if hes pretty much never folding a better hand he played this way, cr'ing cant be better.

hes never playing 6x this way as it ll usually fold the flop and wont vb the river in position vs the flop ck 3bettor, and those are the only hands u could hope to maybe fold out and they are far less likely than 2 pair a set 7x or a draw.

plus ur line looks pretty retarted except for Tx hh or 98, and TP doesnt often cr the river here so u get looked up by whatever he bet for value on the end.

[gobbledygeek]

I'm curious why we didn't lead the flop. With the nut flush and gutshot draws we have pretty huge equity (around 50% or so?); don't we want to build a huge pot and keep as many people around as possible? If we lead then hopefully CO raises so we can trap UTG+1 and MP; if we checkraise then there is the possibility that we blow them out of the hand. Or do we want to do this in order to fold better Aces? Plus I'd gag if CO totally whiffed and lets the flop check thru.

GcluelessnoobG

[SeaEagle]

This might be the single post where I spent the most time flipping back and forth between the responses and the hand description to see the action.

You'd definitely get a note in your file if I were sitting at the table. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Your hand can only be 89, a flopped straight, or a bluff. And it's really oddly played for a flopped straight since you wouldn't want to risk a free card on the turn with two hearts on board.

We can be pretty sure UTG has a hand - he bet out on the turn risking some FPS action from a dude who c/3-bet the flop and then checked a safe turn card, and he's also betting out into the PF and flop raiser, who's very possibly on an overpair.

I can't imagine very many villians folding in this scenario. Personally, I'd call you and expect to see 89 about half the time, but no where near the 90%+ I'd need to fold whatever hand I was betting.

[James.]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm curious why we didn't lead the flop. With the nut flush and gutshot draws we have pretty huge equity (around 50% or so?); don't we want to build a huge pot and keep as many people around as possible? If we lead then hopefully CO raises so we can trap UTG+1 and MP; if we checkraise then there is the possibility that we blow them out of the hand. Or do we want to do this in order to fold better Aces? Plus I'd gag if CO totally whiffed and lets the flop check thru.

GcluelessnoobG

[/ QUOTE ]

on the flop: pot's big. i was trying to clean up some ace outs.

i totally screwed the big street actions up on this hand, so please disregard. thanks. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]