$10 NL - Should I fold getting >3:1 pre-flop vs. all-in?

[microDonk]

This was one of the last hands of my session today, and I felt it was a very tough decision. Given the action, it seems like an obvious fold with JJ. The problem is I was getting about 3.3:1 on the call. I'm not great with ranges and equity calculations, so I was hoping someone who is could offer some of their insight. Thanks in advance.


Poker Stars - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.05/$0.10 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

SB: $6.05
BB: $6.35
UTG: $13.40
MP: $6.15
<font color="black">Hero (CO): $11.75</font>
BTN: $14.90

<font color="black">Reads: </font><font color="blue">BB was 53/0/1.25 after only 12 hands
MP had just sat down 2 hands earlier
Both bought in for $6</font>

<font color="black">Preflop:</font> Hero is dealt J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6 Players)
<font color="red">UTG raises to $0.40</font>, MP calls $0.40, <font color="red">Hero raises to $2.10</font>, 2 folds, <font color="red">BB raises all-in to $6.35</font>, UTG folds, MP calls all-in for $5.75, Hero ???

[Ikaika]

If you make villain's range TT+, AQ+ you only need 2:1 to call here. A tighter range(which I'm very hesitant to assign to two obvious retards) of QQ+ and AK for each villain leaves you needing 3:1 to call.

Calling is fine here.

[Vivalution]

Ikaika, what are you using to calculate the equity with ranges?

I am calling here with those kind of odds.

[Monster207]

Yeah definitely calling with those odds.

[Archon_Wing]

Once you put that 3bet in, I wouldn't fold given stack sizes. Heck, I do this with Ak vs this 60 bb [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[microDonk]

Two quick questions:

1) Ikaika, why are we so quick to assume they are obvious retards?

2) Does JJ really have this much equity against 2 players all-in?

[BishopsFinger]

[ QUOTE ]
If you make villain's range TT+, AQ+ you only need 2:1 to call here. A tighter range(which I'm very hesitant to assign to two obvious retards) of QQ+ and AK for each villain leaves you needing 3:1 to call.

Calling is fine here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

19,673,061,408 games 32.844 secs 598,984,941 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 33.931% 31.14% 02.80% 6125230152 550060580.00 { TT+, AQs+, AQo+ }
Hand 1: 33.931% 31.14% 02.80% 6125230152 550060580.00 { TT+, AQs+, AQo+ }
Hand 2: 32.138% 31.20% 00.94% 6137683032 184796912.00 { JJ }


Text results appended to pokerstove.txt

6,267,087,288 games 10.422 secs 601,332,497 games/sec

Board:
Dead:

equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 36.943% 32.96% 03.98% 2065536396 249731676.00 { QQ+, AKs, AKo }
Hand 1: 36.943% 32.96% 03.98% 2065536396 249731676.00 { QQ+, AKs, AKo }
Hand 2: 26.113% 25.98% 00.13% 1628146152 8404992.00 { JJ }

meant to quote the 'what did you use to get those stats' post but w/e.

pokerstooveee

[microDonk]

Thank-you for the reply Bishops. I actually just decided to download PokerStove and try it out for myself, and I ran basically the same numbers you did. Needless to say I was a little surprised. This is only a fold if I put them on QQ+,AKs or better for their ranges. Obviously, even with this action, those ranges are unreasonable.

Well I guess this was an expensive lesson in equity for me. If I had PokerStove downloaded, I probably could have run those stats and figured out it was a call while I was at the table. Instead, I folded and watch MP's AKo take the pot on a Q high board against BB's KJo. I almost threw up.

[Ikaika]

See? My assumption that villains = retarded was correct. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

At 10nl, if someone buys in for $6 and gets it in on their third hand I'm not gonna give them much credit at all. Worst case scenario, I double him up and then stack him later.

[microDonk]

Yeah Ikaika, I knew your assumption was correct from the start (obviously), I was just playing the Devil's Advocate and wondering why you came to that conclusion. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]