New to LHE

[ssx22]

Hello.

I am just looking for some general advice. I have been playing poker for over 2 years. I mostly play in small home games and online. However, until recently, I have primarily played NLHE (usually 1-2, 2-4NL).

I have decided to play some LHE as I believe it will reduce the swings of online poker and allow myself to steadily grow my bankroll. I currently have an online bankroll of $75 and am playing the .10-.20 game. When I play live, I play $2-4.

What I need advice on is this...In NLHE, I am a very aggressive player and like to switch gears alot. In my brief experience in LHE, I notice that the majority of tables I play at, the average player is very loose/passive. As a result, I try to play tight aggressive for the most part and throw in a small bluff every so often just to make sure people know I am capable of betting without the best hand.

Last night, I played a full ring game at my local casino. I played very TA, playing about 25-30% of hands. I generally played very little in early position and played small pairs and suited connectors in later positions. Very few pots were raised pf and most pots have 7-8 players. I left the game after 4 hours and was down 9BB. I didn't think that was too bad except for after thinking about my game, there was hardly any hand I felt I didn't play as well as I could have.

Is this the right approach to be taking or should I loosen up my game more (if you can't beat them, join em!)?

Thanks for your help.

[Buzz-cp]

You should probably take a hand chart. 30% is pretty high for a limit game--you need to tighten up. Well-timed aggression is fine, but you can't bluff as easily in limit--ppl aren't going to fold one pair getting 10:1. The focus here should be on value-betting. In tougher games, blind steals and hand-reading become important, although I am not much of an expert in these games. In very loose games like the live 2/4, you should be limping along with suited connectors, any pair, any suited ace and flop goot--again, see a hand chart.

[ssx22]

Thanks for the reply.

I'm a little confused. On the one hand, you say that 30% is too high and on the other hand, you say play any suited connector, pair and suited ace. Keep in mind that I am seeing the flop almost every time on each blind which is 20% of all hands right there. That means that I am only playing about 1 hand per orbit outside of the blinds...it doesn't get a whole lot tighter than that. I have been playing poker for a while...i am just new to LIMIT.

As for the bluffing. I wasn't bluffing because I was hoping to win the hand. I was bluffing so that the few people who actually noticed me playing extremely tight might actually pay me off when I did get a good hand and bet it accordingly. The last thing I wanted to do was play tight for 2 hours, finally get a good hand and have everyone fold.

What I am trying to get from the great resources here is...

I played for 4 hours, I bet every time I was ahead and folded when I was beat. I can honestly say, there might have only been one hand that I would have played differently and that would have only saved me 1 BB. As I am new to LHE...especially micro stakes, I am just wondering if this is normal and if it is, is there any better strategy than the one I applied.

[fretelöo]

Yes, it is normal. Swings in limit are just as bad as in NL, possibly even worse so, since you can't deny ppl the correct odds to draw to their flushes or straights. So there'll be times where you'll get sucked out on left and right over and over again, because if villain wants to keep it cheap at 3.5BB/hand, he can do so and there's little you can do to prevent it.

Moving to limit because you hate the swings is probably [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[Xhad]

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Keep in mind that I am seeing the flop almost every time on each blind which is 20% of all hands right there.

[/ QUOTE ]

You should be folding from the SB more than you realize then. Any suited, any pair, any broadway are basically always playable in unraised pots but you should shy away from your weaker offsuit hands. Position matters.

[ QUOTE ]
As for the bluffing. I wasn't bluffing because I was hoping to win the hand. I was bluffing so that the few people who actually noticed me playing extremely tight might actually pay me off when I did get a good hand and bet it accordingly.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not getting enough calldowns is not a problem in limit...you WANT to be able to steal pots in this game, but if they're calling down anyway then go ahead and value them to death. Also, if they're making especially bad calldowns they probably don't notice or don't care how tight you are so your bluffs are wasted. This isn't like NL where you can stack someone on one big hand and even a fish can find a fold for one bet on a scary board.

[ QUOTE ]
I played for 4 hours, I bet every time I was ahead and folded when I was beat. I can honestly say, there might have only been one hand that I would have played differently and that would have only saved me 1 BB.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm currently running at 30PTBB/100 in my NL excursion. It's about as sustainable. Showdowns will often feature you getting odds like 5:1, 7:1, even sometimes 19:1 on a river call, you should NOT be winning the majority of the time you call the river because the pot is usually laying you odds. You are going to lose, and you are going to pay off sometimes, it's a fact of minbet holdem.

[Xhad]

[ QUOTE ]
Moving to limit because you hate the swings is probably [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

I wish I could remember who gave me this analogy: LHE downswings are chinese water torture, NL downswings are a french guillotine.

[Fantam]

[ QUOTE ]
I generally played very little in early position and played small pairs and suited connectors in later positions. Very few pots were raised pf and most pots have 7-8 players.

Is this the right approach to be taking or should I loosen up my game more (if you can't beat them, join em!)?

Thanks for your help.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you were getting 7 or 8 players limping preflop with little raising, I think that you probably could loosen your positional starting requirements somewhat. But dont join the fish and play any two cards !

Under these conditions, you could play any pair from EP and probably a fair number of suited connectors. You could also be playing suited 1 and 2 gappers, but I would prefer to play these from later position.

I dont know how you play unsuited high cards in NL, but I would also be limping/raising with AJ & KQ from EP, and calling with hands like KTo & QTo from later positions.

Basically, you can afford to play a lot of speculative hands in the table conditions that you describe, which you are looking to win big pots with when you hit. In the meantime, you would still be value betting/raising with your premium hands.

Also, I would not be betting/raising postflop to boost my "table image". However, I would be betting/raising my good hands and draws for value, and calling liberally when pot odds justified peeling with weaker draws.

As you appreciate, bluffs are less effective in full ring loose passive games. Value betting probably becomes your most effective strategy.

[Ignignokt]

[ QUOTE ]
I have decided to play some LHE as I believe it will reduce the swings of online poker and allow myself to steadily grow my bankroll.

[/ QUOTE ]

If this is the sole reason why you're playing limit, you're in trouble. Limit has higher variance than NL.

If you want to grow your bankroll steadily, play short-stack NL (that is, play it properly, with no random ace-small pushes or chasing draws). Variance will be as low as it gets. It is also boring as hell, but you get what you pay for.

[Fantam]

[ QUOTE ]
LHE downswings are chinese water torture, NL downswings are a french guillotine.

[/ QUOTE ]

I [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] this analogy. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[ssx22]

Hey guys...thanks for the great thoughts.

Interesting to hear most of you say that LHE is worse than NLHE for swings. I would have never thought that.

The reason I have switched to LHE is that I am trying to strengthen the mental part of my game (mainly patience). I have done fairly well at NLHE in the past 2 years. I have won many tournaments and, at times, have dominated the cash games. My problem is that I will build my online bankroll to, say. $1K or so, start playing in the .50/$1 NL game, have a rought couple of weeks, fall to $400 or so, deicde I should keep playing this game, except this time, I will play 4 tables at once. Needless to say, this doesn't always work [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

I decided that I would build my bankroll the right way, moving up levels or down, etc. and I figured that it would be really hard to get too frustrated with LHE because even if I make one bad play, it only costs me 1 bet and I won't lose any sleep over that.

Again, thanks for the responses.