Live 1/3, Flopped Straight (Seeing Monsters)

Makonnen · #1 05-04-2007, 03:59 AM

Live 1/3 pot limit game, 6 handed. You have the table covered and have announced that you're leaving in about 20 mins. Villain is on your right, has about $250, and seems pretty tight--certainly much tighter than the rest of the donkeys.

You have 5 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. 2 calls in front of you, you call, SB calls, BB checks. So, 5 players, $15 in the pot. Flop is 4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. Gin!

Villain bets $10, you raise to $35. Everyone else folds, Villain calls. Turn is 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

Villain checks, you ...

kayfish77 · #2 05-04-2007, 04:05 AM

pot it. cry if the river is a diamond or pairs board. what are stack sizes?

corsakh · #3 05-04-2007, 04:08 AM

... fold?

Nemesis69 · #4 05-04-2007, 04:11 AM

3/4 - pot bet, take the pot right there

ijustliketoplay · #5 05-04-2007, 05:37 AM

Pot. this is really straightforward....

Doug Funnie II · #6 05-04-2007, 05:40 AM

Yeah anything less than 3/4 pot here is isn't enough. I think he has a hand like A5d,A6d,A7d pretty often which you can't let draw cheap.

Makonnen · #7 05-04-2007, 01:41 PM

Yeah, see, that's exactly what I did.

But he almost insta-folds, and says he had TPTK, no diamonds. Which made me think about the whole current discussions about betting to make life easier, as opposed to betting to extract maximum value.

I wonder if a smaller bet--or even a check--may not be EV+ long run. I mean, I flopped the joint, and if you're going to play hands like that, these situations matter, since you miss so often: shouldn't I be looking to _extract_ not protect? And isn't the instinct that he must have diamonds seeing monsters?

Brad1970 · #8 05-04-2007, 04:42 PM

Your opponent having a diamond draw in this spot is perfectly logical & is not MOBS. If you have ever played live very much, you will know that most live players, especially the fish, love them some soooooooooted cards. It doesn't have to be big suited connectors, ANY 2 soooooooooted cards will do.

Hince · #9 05-04-2007, 06:16 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Yeah, see, that's exactly what I did.

But he almost insta-folds, and says he had TPTK, no diamonds. Which made me think about the whole current discussions about betting to make life easier, as opposed to betting to extract maximum value.

I wonder if a smaller bet--or even a check--may not be EV+ long run. I mean, I flopped the joint, and if you're going to play hands like that, these situations matter, since you miss so often: shouldn't I be looking to _extract_ not protect? And isn't the instinct that he must have diamonds seeing monsters?

[/ QUOTE ]

You have to remember that you have the best hand. You extract the most money from getting value from the 2nd best hand, not little one pair type hands or by letting weak hands out draw you. You are betting for value primarily, as you are a huge favorite over many many other hands the protection is a side effect.