Short-Stacked Home Game Strategy

[MTUCache]

Hey guys, great forum. I'm new here, as well as a relatively new player, but I'm learning (and finding) more and more information daily here, which I am very greatful for.

Now... to my question.

I play in a monthly homegame that's a little odd. For some reason, the host feels that having different denominations of chips will be too confusing, and likes to keep a simple (direct) correlation between chips and money. Now, I'm thinking this is pretty common, but I don't think he understands the effect that it has on the tournament. His solution has been to equate each chip to $0.50, so that our $20 tournament buy-ins (it's a no-limit freezeout) gets us 40 chips.

Starting the blinds at 1/2 means that from the very first hand, people only have 20xBB. Increasing the blinds to 2/4, 3/6, 4/8, etc from there in 20 minute increments basically means that the 20+ person tournament is down to a final table within 2 hours, and over within 3.

The 20+ person crowd is a good mix of below-average to average homegame, small-stakes players. Some very aggressive, some mildly tight, but none having any real experience.

I'm definitely at the high end of the players there. In five months I've made the final table 3 times (all shortstacked however). Also in those five months, we have totally different people at those FTs, with only a couple of other players making multiple appearances besides myself. Basically, it's a complete crapshoot.

I've read both HoH Vol 1 and 2, and I'm familiar with the generally held concepts that tight play is the norm when a tournament begins, and aggressive play is the norm after the blinds start increasing. I also recognize that playing tight when we're starting halfway down Harrington's "Orange Zone" isn't a very good thing. Plus, after 20 minutes, even the chip leaders are already in the "Yellow Zone" as the blinds go up to 2/4.

Following HoH's guidelines, after one or two lost pots (or just waiting too long), 75% of the field is well into the "Red Zone". After reading HoH, it's pretty obvious that I can't let myself get in this situation. I need to push much more often (with any decent hand), and either hope for a very passive table, or hope to win more than one coin-flip for large pots early in the tournament.

Is there any particular style in this game that's going to create a benefit for me? Starting off very aggressive? Trying to double-up with any premium hand (KillPhil style)? Obviously playing tight early isn't getting me anywhere, because I squeak into the final table, only to be beatup by the largestacks of the luckbox-fish who just happen to stumble blindly into the FT by sucking out on a few other players.

Or is this just a complete crapshoot, and I should save my $20 for the cash games afterwards and just show up late?

[MTUCache]

One thought I had, which I think may be worth some feedback...

In these types of "short-term" scenarios, where skilled play is virtually non-existant, and suckouts and bluffs are very common, I'm thinking that it's much more important to be able to read peoples' tells, rather than playing a certain "type" of poker.

The difference between "aggressive" and "tight" in this game isn't much... the stacks are so short that it's the cards that are telling the story. So, playing my opponent is going to be much more important than playing my own cards.

I do have a pretty good grip on which guys are capable of bluffs and who's just a call-station, but in the past I've been so busy playing my own hands that I'm sure I missed out on opportunities to take advantage of this information.

Also... any broad/general advice on position here? Obviously stealing the blinds is going to be a very big deal here, so a early-tight/late-loose strategy comes to mind.

[Snarf]

I'll think about this some more tomorrow when I'll have plenty of free time - but basically, I would just learn to love the words, "all-in"

Honestly, I think I could quite possibly play this tourney 100 times...pending the following exceptions:
rare lucky-ass nights with an actual deepstacks, hands where reads are solid pre-flop, hands where I hold KK or AA, short-handed at the Final table, Blind play, ... and...no I think thats it...

I think you could play the whole thing never doing anything other than being all-in pre-flop....but this push method of play is very different than standard poker. Check out the 1-table forum for learning how/when.

If I could give a 1 sentence cool lesson:
I guess that I'd say that you're not always looking for the best cards, as much the right situations.

[ApeAttack]

I've played in many ~20-25BB short-handed tourneys with friends. Usually, we increase the blinds when a person gets knocked out (which can be quite quick, but occasionly takes 20+ minutes). We play with 4-7 people, with 2nd place getting their buy-in back (we are obviously just playing for fun). While it is much more of a crapshoot than a 100+BB tourney, there are a couple ways that I have adjusted my game that has greatly improved my results.

The biggest change is that I save my chips for times when I have a significant advantage or am getting GREAT direct pot odds. This point is huge for 2 reasons: (1) The implied odds are typically not good since stacks are not deep and (2) any hand that goes bad destroys a larger % of your stack. If I start with 20BB and lose 5BB on a hand that goes bad, I have lost 25% of your stack. Compare that with losing 5BB from a 100BB stack (5% loss). I like to preserve as much of my stack as possible so when I double up, I am in a much stronger position.

[MTUCache]

Thanks guys... I guess both of those suggestions/posts go along with my current line of thought.

Time to stop limping in to community pots, just hoping to catch a flop, and start conserving those chips for some all-in pre-flop positions.

Early position, folding all but premium hands (which will be a large raise).

Late position, raising huge or folding, as stealing blinds and scaring out limpers is far more important than just seeing a flop.

The greatest change in my game is just recognizing that I can't play like everyone else there, and expect to see every flop. All of those guys are building huge pots, with nothing in their hands, and whoever sticks around to catch something on the river usually wins. Meanwhile, I'll be selecting my hands tightly, and playing them very aggressively, knowing that the pots will be huge and I'll be getting in with the best of them.

I suppose the biggest hurdle that I have to overcome is recognizing that going "all-in" is a good thing when I'm holding a better hand than my opponent. Scaring people out of pots when the blinds are so big is a good thing, and if I get called I stand a good chance to double-up.

If I do happen to get sucked out on, and end up leaving the tournament early, it's not necessarily a bad thing, as my cash game play is pretty good against this crowd, especially when I'm playing against the other players who have been knocked out early.

[MTUCache]

Just another thought here, as I keep pondering this situation in my own mind.

One of the main topics dicussed in the "Orange/Yellow Zone" play of HoH is the relative lack of value for small pairs and suited connectors, as the implied odds of a payout when hitting a set or straight/flush isn't nearly enough when you aren't going to be getting at least 24xBB.

So, if possible to limp when in late position, it may be worthwhile to do so. But, in early position, when it's likely that I'll face a raise with my small-PP/suited-connectors, I might as well just fold them, because seeing the flop isn't going to be worth my investment.

Am I looking at this correctly?

[mjws00]

We play these short-stacked tournaments all the time. Often at lunch and afterwork. You don't have to push every hand, you just have to raise big enough for it to matter. If everyone is limping, then limp from late position and beat on them post-flop. Or be that 'prick' that never lets anyone see a flop.

You still have lots of time in these stuctures to let the donks kill each other off. The 18 and 45 player sng's work in the same way, and aren't much different than STT's. Just a slightly longer period of uber tight agressive at the beginning. One double is often all it takes to make it to a point where you can loosen up a little and play poker.

If you can double up early, you need to be a complete and total bully. But it is really no big deal to have an average stack 2/3 of the way through these tournaments.

Play some of these online. Makes the relatively passive live games feel like a piece of cake. No one wants to bust out in 5 minutes so you get lots of tight weak play early on. Either avoid or punish the maniacs when you have a hand.

There is a ton of great information in the STT forum that pretty much applies directly. Harrington's levels can be applied as well, but you need adjust them to the conditions... he is assuming large reasonably deep-stacked tournaments. Pick a factor for M like 2 or 3 times actual and use that as a foundation for shifting gears. You'll end up very close to some of the strategies proposed by the experts making a living from this style of play.

Good Luck,

Mike

[ApeAttack]

whoops... small error. I meant to say,
"If I start with 20BB and lose 5BB on a hand that goes bad, I have lost 25% of MY stack." (not YOUR stack)

[ApeAttack]

[ QUOTE ]

One of the main topics dicussed in the "Orange/Yellow Zone" play of HoH is the relative lack of value for small pairs and suited connectors, as the implied odds of a payout when hitting a set or straight/flush isn't nearly enough when you aren't going to be getting at least 24xBB.

So, if possible to limp when in late position, it may be worthwhile to do so. But, in early position, when it's likely that I'll face a raise with my small-PP/suited-connectors, I might as well just fold them, because seeing the flop isn't going to be worth my investment.

Am I looking at this correctly?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes. Suited connectors and small pocket pairs are all about the implied odds. In this type of structure, I would play them only when I can get a large return on a small investment since the flop is usually not going to help. So I'll only play these two types of hands when (1) I am pretty sure the pot will not get raised (late position), (2) there are a couple limpers who are not all severly short stacked (>6-8BB) and (3) if my stack size can handle a missed flop (~10-15BB or greater). But you knew all this from HoH. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[MTUCache]

Well... I'm back. It's just a little after 5am, so if this gets a little rambling I apologize.

The tournament was different than I thought. All the usual suspects were there, but we surprisingly had no first-timers show up. So, with only 14 in, it was no problem at all to convince the host and the other players to increase the starting stacks to 60, rather than 40.

I stayed tight, made a few moves in late position, pushed around a couple of weak players, and did fairly well. Showed very few hands. Unfortunately, it seemed that each time I'd make some significant gains in the chip department, I'd give them back, so I stayed around my original stack the entire time I was in. The most frustrating thing about the tournament was the table I was at... all buddies, who couldn't stop talking long enough to actually play their hands, so we were only getting in like 1.5 cycles per blind level, which really pissed me off.

Eventually I found myself heads up in a hand against the resident maniac/luckbox/river-rat. I got all my chips in after flopping a set, and got the call I was hoping for, but in true donkey fassion my set of nines got cracked by his open-ended draw on the river (after I gave him 2-1 odds to call his 8-outs of course). So, a dissapointing place, but I feel I played very well. Got my chips in with the best, and took a pretty mild beat.

As for the cash games afterwords... I stayed tight through them as well, playing a similar strategy. My stack got slowly whittled down through blinds and a couple of speculatory hands that didn't pan out. Finally, after a couple hours, the cards turned better and I double up a couple times on pocket pairs.

Then, right around 3am, lightning struck. In SB with T2o. Limped around to me, and I completed (knowing the BB often checks his option). Flop came T62, rainbow. UTG+2 raised to 10, folded around to me, I re-raise to 30, folded back around to him, who calls. At this point, I knew he must have had a weak ten, otherwise he would have raised pre-flop. Turn came a 2, giving me the full house. I overbet all-in, around 150, which looking back on was probably a mistake given my tight-aggressive image at the table. But, fortunately he couldn't lay down the top pair, and doubled me up. To cap off the hand, on the river came the case 2, giving me quads.

About forty minutes later, after not seeing anything exciting, and figuring it was time to go before things got really sloppy, I cashed out, making a handy 25xBB/hour over the six hour session.

All in all, a very satisfying night....