Noob - 1st hand post - pocked 8's

Flexusmark · #1 03-20-2007, 06:35 PM

Hello,

I'am a Noob with about 2300 hands under my belt. I spent some time in the form but this is my first post.

I've read SSHE and I think I have absorbed some of it. Anyway I just wanted to try a post-(converter tool).

I think this hand is pretty standard. My question is should I have raised the turn with p8's

Thanks.

PokerStars 0.05/0.10 Hold'em (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
Hero calls, UTG+1 calls, 2 folds, MP2 calls, 2 folds, Button raises, SB calls, BB calls, Hero calls, UTG+1 folds, MP2 calls.

Flop: (11 SB) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB bets, BB folds, Hero calls, MP2 folds, Button calls.

Turn: (7 BB) J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
SB bets, Hero calls, Button folds.

River: (9 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets, Hero folds.

Final Pot: 10 BB

slamhound · #2 03-20-2007, 06:41 PM

The UTG limp is ungood, unless you are absolutely certain you will get multiple limpers and no raise PF. I refer you to the PF section in SSHE regarding middle pocket pairs. IIRC, it says something to the effect that mid-pocket pairs either play well against a very small field (in which you are more likely win unimproved) or a large field for set value.

Also, fold the flop. You have nowhere near the equity to continue particularly with two left to act behind you including the preflop raiser.

Aaron W. · #3 03-20-2007, 06:45 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The UTG limp is ungood, unless you are absolutely certain you will get multiple limpers and no raise PF. I refer you to the PF section in SSHE regarding middle pocket pairs. IIRC, it says something to the effect that mid-pocket pairs either play well against a very small field (in which you are more likely win unimproved) or a large field for set value.

[/ QUOTE ]

UTG limp is fine in a 10-handed game at very low stakes. I think you're extremely likely to get the 3-4 overlimpers that you want, and raising will not as likely narrow the field.

[ QUOTE ]
Also, fold the flop. You have nowhere near the equity to continue particularly with two left to act behind you including the preflop raiser.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with this. The set outs bring lots of straight redraws, so you're only looking at about 2 outs including your backdoor straight draw.

fretelöo · #4 03-20-2007, 06:46 PM

Any reads?

As is, I'd fold the flop. You have a LP raiser (who doesn't seem pertubed that there are 3 in the pot already - so he's not likely to raise KJo but something reasonable), and SB donking into him on the flop. As there's not a lot of draws on this board to be had, what do you think SB is donking ? If it's an A, you're drawing to 2 outs. Same for a 9.

So, basically for you to continue with your hand, you're hoping that he's donking with air into 4 players. Is that likely? And even if that might be - what's the most likely thing people like to raise pf with? Limp pf with?

As played, I'm not sure why you folded the river. Did you seriously decide on the flop to draw to your backdoor-str8? Loosing strategy, for sure. If you've come so far, you probably have to call and hope he's doing this with 78s.

slamhound · #5 03-20-2007, 06:49 PM

I would need like 20-1 to even consider calling the river. After betting into a big field on that board there's no way he's good 10% of the time.

fretelöo · #6 03-20-2007, 06:56 PM

Strange things happen at 5c/10c. Most of those will not even know what a "big field" is or why that board might look scary. I agree that this is a fold on the flop, but having come as far as the river, it's a sanity-call for me.

slamhound · #7 03-20-2007, 07:01 PM

I might agree, given the stakes, but river calls like this breed bad habits.

fretelöo · #8 03-20-2007, 07:10 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I might agree, given the stakes, but river calls like this breed bad habits.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's why we fold the flop. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

Dr. Matt · #9 03-20-2007, 07:23 PM

with 5 players to the flop, you essentially are playing your pocket 8's for set value. Plus, if you notice... SB isn't exactly the person who showed pf aggression, so I would expect to see SB have an A a good portion of the time. T8 is a possibility, as are 9x and such... all of which beat you at the moment (minus T8 but that hand is slim). In addition, you have Button behind you who showed aggression preflop. A good portion of the time if you call the SB donk-bet to you, you're going to be calling a raise from button as well. You therefore have awful position relative to the original raiser. You are only down to 3.5 outs... (8's, bdsd) so you're already verry thin on a call relative to pot odds. All these combined make for an unprofitable call on the flop. I just fold.

On the turn, you're down to ~1 out to 8's, ~3.5 outs to T's so around 4.5 outs total so you need about 9:1 on your call... you're only given 8:1, again, I'd fold here if I were to misclick the flop.

Flexusmark · #10 03-20-2007, 09:27 PM

Thanks for the replies. I see all of your points and I do agree with the flop fold.

Some of the comments directly relate to playing .05-.10.
Am I wasting my time at this level? My initial deposit was $68 which is now in the $52 level. I now my game needs allot of work so my plan is to stay at .05-.10 until I at least break even back to my starting level before moving up.
I have no problem increasing my BR to $150 to play .25-.50 but this my seam pointless if I am just going to lose more.

I assume that SSHE should apply to all lower limits.

Any advice on this would be appreciated.

Thanks.