25 NL in BB, Made pair on flop, lost to trips

jonny87 · #1 03-09-2007, 02:16 AM

Hi,
this hand really bugs me. I know i played really bad from the my reraise on the turn onwards, but just wondering how I played before that? What do you make of the bets i made on the flop and turn?

Also What hand would you have put him on by the flop, turn and river?
And What would you have done as a result? Any advice, would be great. Thanks

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

UTG ($12.75)
MP ($17.30)
Button ($7.85)
SB ($4.60)
Hero ($15)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
1 fold, MP calls $0.25, 2 folds, Hero checks.

Flop: ($0.60) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $0.5, MP calls $0.50.

Turn: ($1.60) 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $1.25, MP raises to $3, Hero calls $1.75.

River: ($7.60) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, MP bets $5.75, Hero calls $5.75.

Final Pot: $19.10

Results in white below: 
Hero has 9c 6c (two pair, jacks and nines).
MP has Jc As (three of a kind, jacks).
Outcome: MP wins $19.10. 

I dont have any stats for villain and dont know if he was a loose or tight player as this was the first hand I played at this table, and he left shortly after.

I know i should have folded to his reraise on the turn. I dont know what I was thinking lol. And calling his bet on the river was ridiculous! I think I just didnt think he had a jack from calling the flop, looking back on it i should have put him on a set when he reraised on the turn.

Cheers guys

MrMxyztplk · #2 03-09-2007, 03:03 AM

It's not terrible. There are a few draws he can have that MIGHT play this way. The scary thing is the fact that he's waiting to the turn to make that raise.

I think folding the turn might be better. With A9 I might be more inclined to call it, but even then, it's tough to say.

T-Bone98 · #3 03-09-2007, 03:14 AM

[ QUOTE ]

I know i should have folded to his reraise on the turn. I dont know what I was thinking lol. And calling his bet on the river was ridiculous! I think I just didnt think he had a jack from calling the flop, looking back on it i should have put him on a set when he reraised on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

U know what u did wrong. Learn from this and play it better next time. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Genz · #4 03-09-2007, 03:21 AM

1) don't post results. I'm not able to make an objective analysis then.
2) If you know that you messed up the hand, post it in the microbrew and vent it there.
3) A stab on the flop is certainly worth it. After that, I usually shut down. The turn is a blank, so I might be tempted to take another shot and fold out some PP or overcards or a draw and if he raises, I have an easy decision. But after he does just that, your hand is dead. But I know the results, so...
4) tighten up on one-pair hands oop. tighten up in your blind play. 25NL is just not a limit where you need to lag it up and steal pots left and right and need to extract all kind of value from some middle pair. Bet for value when you have the trips, not the small pair...

Everlong · #5 03-09-2007, 03:49 AM

I don't understand what you are doing here? Did you misread the board?

It is alright to fold even though you have money invested in the pot. Bluffcatching is not very profitable imo - just valuebet when you actually have a decent holding.

Check fold turn if you abs feel the need to lead flop...and fold river if you somehow got there.

Even if villain is a total bluff donkey you should pick a better spot to take a stand.

Why do you shortstack?

Vyse · #6 03-09-2007, 04:45 AM

Even if he has a 9 he has you outkicked. I really hate this. Villain is telling you he has you. I shut down totally after the flop. Everything after is really bad.

BoerfSt · #7 03-09-2007, 05:47 AM

Flop play is good but you have to fold the turn.River is ez fold.

Galway · #8 03-09-2007, 05:58 AM

[ QUOTE ]
1) don't post results. I'm not able to make an objective analysis then.
2) If you know that you messed up the hand, post it in the microbrew and vent it there.
3) A stab on the flop is certainly worth it. After that, I usually shut down. The turn is a blank, so I might be tempted to take another shot and fold out some PP or overcards or a draw and if he raises, I have an easy decision. But after he does just that, your hand is dead. But I know the results, so...
4) tighten up on one-pair hands oop . tighten up in your blind play. 25NL is just not a limit where you need to lag it up and steal pots left and right and need to extract all kind of value from some middle pair. Bet for value when you have the trips, not the small pair...

[/ QUOTE ]

#3, Why do we want to "fold out" PPs or overcards, overpockets for sure, but don't we want losing hands to call?

#4 This is excellent advice, one I need to focus on myself.

Genz · #9 03-09-2007, 06:10 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
1) don't post results. I'm not able to make an objective analysis then.
2) If you know that you messed up the hand, post it in the microbrew and vent it there.
3) A stab on the flop is certainly worth it. After that, I usually shut down. The turn is a blank, so I might be tempted to take another shot and fold out some PP or overcards or a draw and if he raises, I have an easy decision. But after he does just that, your hand is dead. But I know the results, so...
4) tighten up on one-pair hands oop . tighten up in your blind play. 25NL is just not a limit where you need to lag it up and steal pots left and right and need to extract all kind of value from some middle pair. Bet for value when you have the trips, not the small pair...

[/ QUOTE ]

#3, Why do we want to "fold out" PPs or overcards, overpockets for sure, but don't we want losing hands to call?

[/ QUOTE ]

In a perfect world, yes. But it results in slowplaying a very mediocre split pair to induce bluffs by weaker PPs. And when you think about it: you check and then you are bet into. Do you confidently call, saying "Yeah, I just got a weaker hand to bluff at me?" Probably not, because you have no idea where you are at. It is certainly not the goal to fold out weaker hands, that's sure. But you don't mind it happening, because you are very weak yourself and because you play against a range of hands that your opponent might have. Therefore you will be put in very marginal spots when you "slowplay" your pair here to induce bluffs from weaker hands, i.e. you will act like a calling station VERY often, it has more value to try to take the pot down right here. That has a) immediate value (you win the pot and you could have the best hand) and b) information value (esp. if villain raises. Not so much when he calls, because everyone is a calling station there. Don't overestimate the usefullness of betting for info.) and c) you can control the pot size because you prevent villain from betting, possibly. So you get to see a card for the price you set. But in general I prefer not to maneuver me in such a spot in the first place.

Galway · #10 03-09-2007, 06:18 AM

I'm sorry if I was unclear. In no way did I mean to advocate a check or a "slowplay" (lol) on this hand. I agree with your prescribed action but just meant to question the motivation. Thanks for clarifying.