3/6:KK i play bad

jstill · #1 02-01-2007, 08:58 PM

both villains are aggressive and somewhat untrustworthy. Hijack in particular steals a wide range and likes to make lots of plays at pots and raises rather light no matter how much strength was shown on previous streets. Both have been playing oddly preflop due to the table dynamic: calling 3bets out of the blinds cold or capping with hands Id fold, capping hands after a call and a 3bet they should just call IMO ect.

hijack raises, Hero 3bets KK in CO, sb calls, bb folds, hijack calls

flop: Js 8 7s
sb checks, hijack checks, hero bets, sb raises, hijack 3bets, hero caps, both call (after i capped I thought maybe i would have been better off just calling to see what sb does and not keeping iniative? maybe I was just being results oriented though since i didnt fold out sb with my cap?)

turn 9
sb checks, hijack checks, hero bets, sb raises, hijack folds, hero..... (getting 7:1 on a calldown now) calls

river Qs
sb bets, hero calls (16:1)

very ugly hand

scottfred · #2 02-01-2007, 09:18 PM

Seeing a showdown cant be a bad thing with those reads, I think maybe since that turn card was really horrible you could have checked behind and called the river bet.

Imagethegod · #3 02-01-2007, 09:46 PM

what was your reasoning for betting the turn? that card screams straight if there wasn't one already and you're almost certainly beat.

I don't even like the flop cap, calldown/check on all streets

jstill · #4 02-01-2007, 10:21 PM

im not sure about much in this hand except for preflop. i duno whats best on the flop and i duno why i bet the turn. i almost checked but couldn't make myself, not sure if i should have bet or checked and not sure if i should have just folded to the check-raise or what, and if i was gonna call down if i should have just folded this river since i pretty much beat nothing now except an overplayed AJ or somethin?

Nick C · #5 02-02-2007, 01:33 AM

Personally, I'd just be thankful that Hijack folded the turn and I got to showdown as cheaply as I did [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img].

I don't know. With reads like these, there are going to be uncomfortable spots like these when the pot is multiway and you have a hand.

That said, I'd be really, really tempted to check the turn, even though that invites your opponents to try to steal the pot away from you on the river with a bet and then a raise [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img].

Yuck. Sometimes the poker gods just seem to conspire against you, like in this hand.

Imagethegod · #6 02-02-2007, 02:14 AM

on the flop you should have just called, since more often than not you're going to get scare cards in the later streets rather than blanks/improving. by capping you're giving up an extra bet on a hand that has a decent chance of becoming a loser, and my philosophy is a bet saved = a bet won.

on the turn you absolutely have to check behind, this is a horrible card for you that more often than not just turned your monster into a kitten. By betting you're setting yourself up to either get bluffed out this pot, or lose even more bets needlessly.

as played, the river bet is again donking chips away with a hand that's on life support right now. i think as played i call down here (hopefully not 4 bets) and kiss my mom if i win the pot.

Solid_p · #7 02-02-2007, 04:40 AM

I think I cold call the 3-bet and raise a safe turn card, instead of capping. With this turn card, I would check behind and call a river bet most of the time. If nobody has the straight, one of them is very likely to have at least two pair. Take the free card and get to showdown, unless it's bet-raise in front of you. If villains were more "trustworthy" (wouldn't c/r without a T or a set), a turn bet-fold would be good.