$15-$30, Flopping the Joint

[cgrohman]

15/30 at the Bellagio.

Full table. Older asian gentleman (OAG) who is UTG+1 raises, 4 callers to me in the SB, I call with A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], BB calls, 7 to the flop

Flop
K [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]10 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

I donk, OAG calls, everyone else folds

Turn
J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

I bet, OAG calls

River:

2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

I bet, OAG raises, I do . . .

In how many places did I mess this hand up terribly?

[benwood]

Check-raise the flop,& call the river.

[cgrohman]

Why the flop check-raise? Given this flop is all over a raiser- and cold callers ranges- why not try for a bet/3-bet here. Plus if I bet and OAG raises, there is a chance that it will drive out drawing hands behind him that could end up beating me.

[benwood]

If pre-flop raiser makes a continuation bet,as he likely will,your check-raise will trap the callers into the pot,creating a big pot that will tie them in.If the raiser 3-bets you,most,or some,of the callers will still call 2 more bets,since they already have one bet "invested",& you will be able to cap,creating a large multi-way pot with you holding the current nuts.

If the flop were2-suited instead of rainbow,maybe it would better to donk into him so his raise could put pressure on a flush draw,but I even then,I would prefer to make the pot-building play rather that the shut-out play,myself.

[cgrohman]

Does my hand really want this to continue to be multi-way? Also, if they are going to call 2 cold after I check raise, why wouldn't they call 2 cold if I bet and he riases- as I had hoped for.

[Grease]

I check/raise the flop since the PRF is just on your left to trap the field with your monster, then just lead the turn.

I can't see why he's raising the turn if he flopped top two or a set, since he would raise either the flop or the turn to build a pot, IMO.

I can see him smooth calling the turn if he fills up though, planning on raising you on the river.

You're getting 13:1. Do you feel comfortable folding to him? I wouldn't without a really solid read, so I would just call the river.

I play it the same minus the flop.

[benwood]

Perhaps your play is best,because this pot is already big enough to think about protection,rather than trapping in more bets,but with this nice nut hand,my greedy instincts would force me to gamble with them & go for the long ball.

[Grease]

[ QUOTE ]
Does my hand really want this to continue to be multi-way? Also, if they are going to call 2 cold after I check raise, why wouldn't they call 2 cold if I bet and he riases- as I had hoped for.

[/ QUOTE ]
Not necessarily. People tend to call many bets if they have any money invested on a current street, and are more apt to fold for two cold, rather than 1 and then 3.

I think you should feel fine building a large multiway pot on a rainbow board with the current nuts. If you don't want to do it now, I can't imagine a time you would.

[thirddan]

"I think you should feel fine building a large multiway pot on a rainbow board with the current nuts. If you don't want to do it now, I can't imagine a time you would. "

exactly...this is a perfect spot for a flop c/r...you are in good position relative to the field and initial aggressor allowing you to c/r multiple people, with the nuts, on a board where people will draw to hands that are dead (namely other Q's)...but this is also a board that hits tons of hands which means that players are going to be willing to go lots of bets, its also a flop that hits a PFR's range very hard allowing the possibility of a ton of action...
i think a c/r is better than a bet/3bet cuz you might get players behind you to put in 3 bets with hands like T9s where they will call the cont bet and be willing to call two more if you c/r and he 3bets because the pot is huge and they already have a bet in...this is a great situation and getting lots of bets in should be a priority...

for those saying protection...just exactly what hand are you protecting yourself from? if a player is on a draw hes pretty much drawing to a split at best, and if a player has a set/2pr they aren't going anywhere (nor should they, big pot)...

[cgrohman]

What about the turn/river as played?