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#1
01-02-2007, 10:45 PM
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2nd pair on monotone flop
UTG 55/5/1, and BB is 70/35/1.5.
Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums) Hero is SB with T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. Preflop: MP calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, Hero completes, BB checks. Flop: (3 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font> Hero... 
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#3
01-02-2007, 11:48 PM
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Re: 2nd pair on monotone flop
[ QUOTE ]
I would start by checking. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah, that sounds like a plan. So let's say that: a) BB bets, UTG calls, Hero... b) BB bets, UTG folds, Hero... c) BB checks, UTG bets, Hero...
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#5
01-03-2007, 09:40 AM
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Re: 2nd pair on monotone flop
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I would start by checking. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah, that sounds like a plan. So let's say that: a) BB bets, UTG calls, Hero... b) BB bets, UTG folds, Hero... c) BB checks, UTG bets, Hero... [/ QUOTE ] This is a very tricky situation. This is what I would probably do: a) fold (although calling might be ok) b) call, reevaluating all options on the turn. c) raise, hoping to fold out BB, as we are very likely ahead.
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#6
01-03-2007, 05:11 PM
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Re: 2nd pair on monotone flop
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I would start by checking. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah, that sounds like a plan. So let's say that: a) BB bets, UTG calls, Hero... b) BB bets, UTG folds, Hero... c) BB checks, UTG bets, Hero... [/ QUOTE ] a) fold. Even though you might be ahead, the pot is small and your implied odds suck. b) call and raise most turn cards. c) fold. UTG is passive, the board is scary, and the pot is small.
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#8
01-04-2007, 02:46 AM
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Re: 2nd pair on monotone flop
[ QUOTE ]
I just hate T8 I mostly fold this in SB/BB, is this a leak? On this board I would like to call it down ui and fold if anouther heart drops because the pot is smalish [/ QUOTE ] this is pretty bad & weak tight. completing 108o is not bad, and playing a hand like this is even worse. you either have the best hand here or you don't, and when you do, calling down and letting people draw cheap is awful.
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#10
01-04-2007, 02:53 PM
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Re: 2nd pair on monotone flop
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] I would start by checking. [/ QUOTE ] Yeah, that sounds like a plan. So let's say that: a) BB bets, UTG calls, Hero... b) BB bets, UTG folds, Hero... c) BB checks, UTG bets, Hero... [/ QUOTE ] Note: I am currently reading Dostoyevsky. A.) Interesting spot. BB could have anything, so a high heart or heart + pair are both fairly high likelihoods when he bets. He's aggro so he is betting with ANYTHING here, often with a piece, often because he knows he's seen both players fold in this spot to a flop bet so he's firing. MP likely has some cardplayer caveat about being careful on monotone flops twisted up a bit and lodged in his mind. He's passive so he's calling with a whole ton of stuff here, pairs and hearts and even stuff like QT no heart etc. He also will run a check with any Ace on whether his Ace could possibly be best or not, and he'll conclude in favor of calling since he's 1-tabling and noticed that BB is a little mental (also just doesn't trust people online). And yeah, he'll end up calling with it. Okay, so think about these ranges. These ranges are as vast as the Pacific Ocean. Folding here is ludicrous. You have a huge hand... a huge hand that is, if showdown came right after the flop. But it doesn't, it waits out there far off and you must cross a perilous expanse to reach it that will twice be slammed by equity shattering thundermeteors. We can't ignore the thundermeteors, but we also can't pathetically surrender to their menace by folding, for we have too much strength lie over and accept doom. Do we have the the confidence to take a stand? To declare war and blow a fierce trumpet out over all the fiefs to issue a challenge that demands either tribute or death? Hell no, I say, hell no. We musn't simply faint away in the shadow of the meteors like the folders would advocate, but we also musn't underestimate their power, which shakes the very roots of the innerhand universe. We will set out beneath a concealing veil of mysterious and silent following along. We decree no ultimatum, we merely sidle along keeping close to the flanks of the haughty aggressor and another distant hanger-on. We shall shy away a bit at first so that we might seize a chance to duck out of the path of the first meteor. From our hiding spot, we'll safely observe whether it demolishes our little house of hope or leaves it standing. And having lived, we can peek out, reflect, and ascertain whether to finally deploy an attack over these altered continents in favor of our desires, end it all quickly to avoid further suffering and get on to being reincarnated in a new hand-universe, or simply lie low once again and submit our ignorance with a shrug, while holding still a keen vigil that will alert our estimations to any new comets of intimation. B.) Well, well, well, my friend, it seems I've caught you, doesn't it? Claiming this treasure which lies between us in a most eager, I daresay transparently OVEReager, and to be as perfectly, frankly honest as I can be, your claim is laughable sir. I may be cautious but I certainly do not fear you. I know you consider yourself to be a firebreathing dragon constantly wreaking the havoc of your power and anger over all those who dare oppose your juggernaut of a will. We must make ready the preparations to crush this beast. Should we launch an immediate blitzkreig with all our muster? Or should we lie in wait, smirking, knowing that the terrain which lies ahead of us will lead this enemy's hasty charge directly into a dead end where he will be trapped and duly slaughtered. I won't be so bold as to advise you on which course to choose. I only suggest you stay consciously aware that the shape of things may shift drastically at any moment. You shouldn't find yourself grasping at the memory of an extinct landscape of variables and assumptions, but forgetting what is dead instantaneously, ascertaining what has become true NOW, not cursing and dreaming about what once was. C.) An entirely different creature than a dragon! This feller is unlikely to puff out his chest without some reason to puff it! Look at him, he doesn't fear EITHER dragon. Of course, he could be relishing an opportunity for deception, a chance for a wily and courageous design of his own, for once! It only means he has something tangible, it doesn't necessarily mean we're crushed. Checkraise has a decent shot at solving the awkward problem of the UTG player, and we can FAIRLY well count on a player of BB's stats to allow us to push him around a bit without pushing back unless he's really got something. I say fire the cannon now and then be strong, but stay alert for counterattacks, because one of those will often mean it's time to abandon ship.
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