(PS $3/$6): Who's Afraid of a Little Spade?

Scotch78 · #1 12-02-2006, 01:37 PM

BB is loose and seems trustworthy. I have not been at this table long, but the few times that I've seen him bet/raise, he's had what he was representing.

MP is going to pay my bills this week. I played 30-45 minutes against him on a $2/$4 table, then went to lunch. When I came back and a seat opened at his table, he was the one that had left. Don't sweat though, he was just moving to a $3/$6 table.

I would estimate that he's playing at least 80% of his hands. He's capable of raising the flop as a (semi-)bluff, and likes to slowplay top pair until he can raise the turn, but otherwise I am willing to trust his raises. His bets are a totally different animal though, especially heads-up. I've seen him bluff all three streets on multiple occassions.

He also likes to slowplay big pocket pairs until the turn, I've seen him raise once pre-flop of the four times that he had JJ+. Oh, and he will let go on a bluff, but not if he has a piece of the board. There's probably more, but that's all I can remember right now.

PokerStars 3/6 Hold'em (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, MP (Baby Maniac) calls, 2 folds, Hero raises, BB 3-bets, MP (Baby Maniac) calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, BB bets, Baby Maniac calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (6 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, Baby Maniac bets, Hero raises

Scott

Jiggymike · #2 12-02-2006, 04:07 PM

Why did you check the flop? I like this play more if BB hadn't 3-bet preflop but that spade appears to have rattled him. I supposed raising>calling but folding is probably the best play of all. I guess with your read it becomes closer between raising and folding because he is capable of a bluff here and you can fold to a 3bet from BB (who might have just been hoping for this exact scenario with a high spade). So yeah, this isn't terrible. What are you going to do if BB fold and Baby Maniac 3 bets?

Scotch78 · #3 12-02-2006, 04:27 PM

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Why did you check the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

I felt that I was behind the BB's range.

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What are you going to do if BB fold and Baby Maniac 3 bets?

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Fold. That's actually why I called him Baby Maniac, because only his betting standards are super-aggressive. If he 3-bets the turn I'd say I'm behind almost every time.

Scott

Jiggymike · #4 12-02-2006, 07:12 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Why did you check the flop?

I felt that I was behind the BB's range.

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So why call the flop then, you probably have very few outs if behind?

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What are you going to do if BB fold and Baby Maniac 3 bets?

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Fold. That's actually why I called him Baby Maniac, because only his betting standards are super-aggressive. If he 3-bets the turn I'd say I'm behind almost every time.

Scott

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Good plan

Scotch78 · #5 12-02-2006, 08:57 PM

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So why call the flop then, you probably have very few outs if behind?

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11-1 pot odds.

Scott

Pepsquad · #6 12-03-2006, 01:55 AM

[ QUOTE ]
BB is loose and seems trustworthy. I have not been at this table long, but the few times that I've seen him bet/raise, he's had what he was representing.

MP is going to pay my bills this week. I played 30-45 minutes against him on a $2/$4 table, then went to lunch. When I came back and a seat opened at his table, he was the one that had left. Don't sweat though, he was just moving to a $3/$6 table.

I would estimate that he's playing at least 80% of his hands. He's capable of raising the flop as a (semi-)bluff, and likes to slowplay top pair until he can raise the turn, but otherwise I am willing to trust his raises. His bets are a totally different animal though, especially heads-up. I've seen him bluff all three streets on multiple occassions.

He also likes to slowplay big pocket pairs until the turn, I've seen him raise once pre-flop of the four times that he had JJ+. Oh, and he will let go on a bluff, but not if he has a piece of the board. There's probably more, but that's all I can remember right now.

PokerStars 3/6 Hold'em (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, MP (Baby Maniac) calls, 2 folds, Hero raises, BB 3-bets, MP (Baby Maniac) calls, Hero calls.

Flop: (9 SB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, BB bets, Baby Maniac calls, Hero calls.

Turn: (6 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, Baby Maniac bets, Hero raises

Scott

[/ QUOTE ]

This doesn't feel like a +EV play.

I'm thinking Bet/Fold turn > Check/Fold Turn > Check/Raise turn.

The problem comes when Baby Maniac holds a better hand but not A-Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. I don't see you folding a better hand here very often, and the majority of the time I try this the c/r is just called. So the river is a brick and you start letting the thought creep into your head that you're actually good and lead the river OR you check the river and many times face one last bet getting 11:1 on your call. To me, the turn C/R just seems to allow this guy to play the rest of the hand perfectly...at the greatest possible expense to you.

Heisenb3rg · #7 12-05-2006, 12:08 AM

I'm fairly undecided about the turn raise.

You're investing about 3 BB for 8BB. Maybe only 2 if he has a high spade and 3 bets.

You're equity vs a random hand (poker stove) is 42%.
But he almost definitly has better than an average hand.
You're probabily not folding out a better hand.
To counter that he may fold hands that have plenty odds to draw to, knowing what you had like QJ/A9 (these players peel extremly loose).

Im torn. It's probabily a fold, but it's a nice FPS move. perhaps the entertaininment value of pulling/suceeding a move like this is worth it :P

27offsooot · #8 12-05-2006, 12:14 AM

I like this very much if BB is TAG. A very loosish BB isn't going to fold an overpair here. I'm not sure by your description where along the continuum that our BB lies. Stats might help.

I think that this play is good against an unknown though.