600nl 3-bet PF JJ on Q-hi flop, 3-way

[Teph]

Effective stacks are 600, (first hand)

Not much history with UTG+1 (< 100 hands in history) Seems weak-tight
A lot of history with SB, he's pretty loose, takes weird lines with draws, tries to be too tricky.

Both villains know me as a lag, probably think I am bad from prior experience.

No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $3/$6
6 players

Pre-flop: (5 players) Hero is BB with J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
UTG calls $6, <font color="red">UTG+1 raises to $21</font>, 1 folds, SB calls $18, <font color="red">Hero raises to $88</font>, UTG folds, UTG+1 Calls $67.00, SB calls $67.00.


Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($270, 2 players)
SB checks, <font color="red">Hero ???</font>


Check seems off to me, so if you c-bet how much?

What happens if:

UTG+1 Calls | Pushes (Assume SB folds)
SB Calls | Pushes


Will post Hero's action and rest of hand after some input.

Thanks

[luckychewy]

i would just check it. pretty bad flop as you now lose to 99 and AQ, in addition to aa-qq that utg was trapping with pf. sb almost always has a pair here imo so if he is behind you only have to dodge a 2 outter, and unless the utg is super crazy aggro i wouldn't worry too much about getting bluffed. i would just check and fold if it gets bet, maybe bet a safe turn, sometimes just completely give up.

[jrbick]

My goodness. I think I'm checking and seeing what UTG+1 does.

FWIW I'd raise bigger preflop, probably to 125 or so.

[Teph]

I have been on a retarded cooler, took a break for the rest of the day...

Anyways, my thinking was that if flop got checked through, I would have the best hand here a lot. Also, I c-bet like always here, so I bet 180 (2/3 pot). If UTG+1 puts another penny in, I am done with the hand unless I spike a J. If SB calls, I think I am checking most turns, and making a decision on river. If SB pushes, I am kind of stuck.

Anyways...

Flop: 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($270, 2 players)
SB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets $180</font>, UTG+1 folds, <font color="red">SB raises all in for $497.40</font>, Hero calls $317.40


FWIW, hero has seen villain crai with terrible draws/second pairs before. He has no grasp on the term fold equity. He also knows that hero c-bets nearly every time, and has the ability to lay down big hands.

With this information and getting over 3:1 this is call all day right?


This hand keeps bugging me.

[dtan05]

teph - i don't think he has second pair in a reraised flop, and that leaves us with 1) bluffs, and 2) TEH GOODZZZ

do you think he's bluffing 3/4 times?

[Teph]

[ QUOTE ]
teph - i don't think he has second pair in a reraised flop, and that leaves us with 1) bluffs, and 2) TEH GOODZZZ

do you think he's bluffing 3/4 times?

[/ QUOTE ]

Villain plays flush draw and set the same here, and QQ is absolutely out of question. 99 is even a pretty big stretch, he 3-bets this all day from original UTG+1 raise.

Only other hand is AQ, but what does he expect to call that he beats?

[jrbick]

I'm folding to push.

[dtan05]

why is QQ absolutely out of the question? you said yourself he tries to be too tricky, unless he's really aggro pre?
additionally you left out KK and AA, not to mention 55/99, which are possible for poser tricky players.

and lol he could just be wanting you to fold (with AQ), you said he makes this bet with 2nd pair sometimes, so he doesn't always expect a call from a worse hand.

[Teph]

[ QUOTE ]
why is QQ absolutely out of the question? you said yourself he tries to be too tricky, unless he's really aggro pre?
additionally you left out KK and AA, not to mention 55/99, which are possible for poser tricky players.

and lol he could just be wanting you to fold (with AQ), you said he makes this bet with 2nd pair sometimes, so he doesn't always expect a call from a worse hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

Good point. He is very aggressive pre-flop, he re-pops AA-88 from the SB there. If he was getting "tricky" and flat calling AA-QQ, he would certainly shove after my re-raise/UTG+1 call.

[duh]

[ QUOTE ]
Only other hand is AQ, but what does he expect to call that he beats?

[/ QUOTE ]

here is your answer:

[ QUOTE ]
hero has seen villain crai with terrible draws/second pairs before.

[/ QUOTE ]