Two scenarios from Slotboom DVD

[rvg72]

I found this to be very interesting - is this really obvious? Do you feel the same way?

Assume everyone has effective stacks of $90 playing $1/$2 and are unknowns (I know, generalizing is bad but just play along)

Scenario 1)

You have 98s on the button.
UTG limps in for $2
UTG+1 raises to $7
Hero?

Scenario 2)

You have 98o on the Big Blind
UTG raises to $7
UTG+1 calls
Hero?

I'll post his answer and explanation in a bit.

rvg

[ImsaKidd]

Fold both. You don't know if they always stack off with TP/etc, and you don't hit the flop enough to make this a profitable play (low implied odds).

[Grumbo]

Would probably fold both since you only have 45BBs.

Scenario 1 might be near a call since you are in a position in a multiway pot with the potential to flop a huge hand or draw.

Scenario 2 is almost always a fold since you're OOP which is always a difficult situation for drawing hands.

[disciple]

I either 4 bet or fold the first hand.

Fold on second hand. not enough implied odds with regard to relative positions.

[carnivalhobo]

they are clear folds IMO, it seems like he says to call or raise though otherwise why would you post this? whats his rationalization?

[rvg72]

Here is his analysis on the hands (hopefully I don't butcher it too badly)

#1 is a clear fold due primarily to the position of the preflop raiser.
* You are not closing the action - the SB, BB or UTG players could reraise you out of this pot
* On almost every flop the UTG will check regardless of the strength of his hand. Even though he is UTG he is essentially the button here because his first real act will be after the villain and hero play.
* You will be facing a continuation bet and potentially a check raise so you need to hit this VERY hard to continue.
* Calling almost 8% of stack is too much

I fold this due to the preflop considerations but what was eye opening for me was his post flop analysis. He argues that even though you are on the button, you are probably in the worst possible position in this hand due to the positions of the preflop bettor and caller.

#2 he argues is a call for similar reasons mentioned above.

* You close the preflop betting
* When you miss the flop you let the hand go and it only cost you $5.
* You can check any flop here and essentially act as the button. If the Villain bets and the preflop caller calls you now have a bigger pot for you draw / big hand. You can reraise them off the hand squeezing the villain out or call and evaluate on turn. Additionally, since stacks are relatively short it will be more tempting for weaker hands to call your raise if you decide to do that.

Basic idea is by always checking you will lose small pots, win larger ones and discourage players to bet out when you check in future games etc.

rvg

[delta k]

the second hand you flop a pair of 8 or 9 and are unable to get away from it given stack sizes and you donate to KK. wtf, that's a simple fold even for me. if you flop a draw you're not deep enough to have any sort of FE

[n1nj4.br]

fold both.

[Mr_Donktastic]

Fold both.

I might call the first one if stacks were 100BB or more.

[wpr101]

I hate the call on the 2nd one. I don't mind the call on the first one as much being in position. However, they are probably both folds due to the tiny stack sizes. WTF is he giving examples with unrealistic stacks for this game?