Flags of Our Fathers

[Dominic]

Saw it this past weekend...decent movie, but I expected more from Clint, for some reason. The prologue and epilogue that takes place in today's world were muddled and uninvolving. The Iwo Jima sequences were well done, but it was hard to discern who was who at times.

Even when the three survivors of the famous flag raising were back home, making their nation-wide tour in order to raise war bonds, it was still confusing over who exactly the other three were (who had died after the flag raising.)

The only characters of the main threesome we really get to know at all is Ira Hayes, played by an excellent Adam Beach. However, his Native American character is fairly one-dimensional in its portrayal of an alcholic Indian who must face blatant racism, even from his fellow soliders.

All in all, fairly decent and worth seeing...but again, a disappointment.

[Ronald White]

I figured somebody was going to hop on the Indian stereotype. Well, its not a stereotype if its true. The writer of the movie was reporting the story, not the other way around. Why do you need the PC police for this. Should we pretend that he ended up being a casino tycoon? Life is rough, and sometimes the truth is hard to swallow.

[Rick Nebiolo]

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The Iwo Jima sequences were well done, but it was hard to discern who was who at times.

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I think that was even more true for the soldiers who fought there.


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Even when the three survivors of the famous flag raising were back home, making their nation-wide tour in order to raise war bonds, it was still confusing over who exactly the other three were (who had died after the flag raising.)

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I don't think it was necessary to know who they were from the beginning given that the flag raisers didn't even realize what they did was any big deal at the time. Also keep in mind there were four who died, since one raised the original flag and didn't raise the replacement (where the picture was taken) and one was in the famous picture but not given credit for raising the flag.


[ QUOTE ]
The only characters of the main threesome we really get to know at all is Ira Hayes, played by an excellent Adam Beach. However, his Native American character is fairly one-dimensional in its portrayal of an alcholic Indian who must face blatant racism, even from his fellow soliders.

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I read the book and I thought the movie Ira Hayes ran pretty true. IMO the movie is a must see and perhaps as good a depiction of WW2 as Saving Private Ryan.


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All in all, fairly decent and worth seeing...but again, a disappointment.

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I was disapointed that on an opening Friday night the theatre was only ten percent full. I guess we are forgetting WW2.

~ Rick

PS It will be interesting to see the movie Clint made (coming out next Spring) of Iwo Jima from a Japanese perspective.

[BluffTHIS!]

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PS It will be interesting to see the movie Clint made (coming out next Spring) of Iwo Jima from a Japanese perspective.

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I will be very interested to see that too. There haven't been nearly enough movies about WWII from other than american/british perspectives. The Russian front especially has received relatively short shrift in the movies although Enemy At The Gates was decent.

[Exsubmariner]

Dominic,
Ira Hayes himself became the thing that everyone remembered from the history after the war was all over. They didn't remember the battle, or the bond drive, they remembered Ira. It's too much to go into, but there is a lot out there about Ira. There was even another movie before this one about the three men's fates after the war.

Johnny Cash sang the ballad of Ira Hayes.
"The Ballad of Ira Hayes
Gather round me people there's a story I would tell
About a brave young Indian you should remember well
From the land of the Pima Indian
A proud and noble band
Who farmed the Phoenix valley in Arizona land

Down the ditches for a thousand years
The water grew Ira's peoples' crops
'Till the white man stole the water rights
And the sparklin' water stopped

Now Ira's folks were hungry
And their land grew crops of weeds
When war came, Ira volunteered
And forgot the white man's greed

Call him drunken Ira Hayes
He won't answer anymore
Not the whiskey drinkin' Indian
Nor the Marine that went to war

There they battled up Iwo Jima's hill,
Two hundred and fifty men
But only twenty-seven lived to walk back down again

And when the fight was over
And when Old Glory raised
Among the men who held it high
Was the Indian, Ira Hayes

Call him drunken Ira Hayes
He won't answer anymore
Not the whiskey drinkin' Indian
Nor the Marine that went to war

Ira returned a hero
Celebrated through the land
He was wined and speeched and honored; Everybody shook his hand

But he was just a Pima Indian
No water, no crops, no chance
At home nobody cared what Ira'd done
And when did the Indians dance

Call him drunken Ira Hayes
He won't answer anymore
Not the whiskey drinkin' Indian
Nor the Marine that went to war

Then Ira started drinkin' hard;
Jail was often his home
They'd let him raise the flag and lower it
like you'd throw a dog a bone!

He died drunk one mornin'
Alone in the land he fought to save
Two inches of water in a lonely ditch
Was a grave for Ira Hayes

Call him drunken Ira Hayes
He won't answer anymore
Not the whiskey drinkin' Indian
Nor the Marine that went to war

Yeah, call him drunken Ira Hayes
But his land is just as dry
And his ghost is lyin' thirsty
In the ditch where Ira died"

[FortunaMaximus]

<sighs> Yeah. Beach's a genuine talent. Canadian, actually, and I'm sure anyone who's interested enough in his early career should be able to track down "North of 60."

I'm more interested in Eastwood's take on the Japanese side of the conflict, and, you'd have to think he is too.

But without a doubt his body of work as a director is one of Hollywood's contemporary best as a whole.

Not that I've seen the movie, and probably won't 'till it's on DVD. I find it's easier to judge a movie on its merits without the theater experience and once the initial fuss has blown over. And after all, the good ones get discussed endlessly.

[Oatdyke McFluff]

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I was disapointed that on an opening Friday night the theatre was only ten percent full. I guess we are forgetting WW2.

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The movie has no star power, was not heavily advertised over the past month, and looks exactly like SPR in a lot of the previews. I'm not sure anybody thought it was going to be raking in.

[Blarg]

It also markets like a downer. People are already down about the present war and racial issues; selling them on being down about our hallowed past is especially hard.

[nyc999]

Dom, did you read the book? If so, any comparisons?

I loved the book, and from your review, sounds like Clint didn't do it justice. In a way it makes sense because the book spent so much time on the backstory of each soldier who raised the flag. I'm sure some screenwriter latched onto one or two themes and developed a story around it.

[Dominic]

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I figured somebody was going to hop on the Indian stereotype. Well, its not a stereotype if its true. The writer of the movie was reporting the story, not the other way around. Why do you need the PC police for this. Should we pretend that he ended up being a casino tycoon? Life is rough, and sometimes the truth is hard to swallow.

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I didn't say it didn't happen, I just said it was sterotypical; i.e. boring.