89s UTG+1 Live, My first attempt at NL

Grizwold · #1 10-23-2006, 05:16 PM

I'm a new limit hold'em player. I have not been playing seriously for more than a year, and have read a handful of important books for limit play. Even though I prefer to play limit now, I do eventually plan to study NL as well. So I have not gotten to read book like HOH 1, 2, 3, or NLHETAP or Championship Pot-Limit and No-Limit Hold'em, although I plan to eventually. Nevertheless I decided to try NL one night, mainly because my friends were playing in the game, and I still wanted to give this game a shot. That's all I ever played w/ my friends at home games but we only played s'n'g style and I knew this was gonna be a much different experience. I never posted any NL hands on 2+2 yet, so here goes my first, a live one... I wonder if my flop play was ok and even if my preflop play was acceptable. Maybe you would be able to tell that I am a limit player...

Reads: Villain 2 is raising all-in a lot. He seems to enjoy pushing his 4 racks to the center and keeps saying as soon as he hits $500 he's leaving. His friend had just busted out and was sweating Villain 2 now. He is definately the most active player at the table, but I have no idea if that's right or wrong. Villain 1 prolly has the second highest VP$IP at this table. However he does not put in a lot of big bets and ends up showing down very few hands. During hands he's often said he is ready to call someone all in.

NL 50 Buy-In, $2 BB, 9 Players
Villain #1 is on BB and stack size $76
Villain #2 is CO and stack size $400
Hero's is UTG+1 and stack size $75

Preflop: Hero is dealt 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] UTG+1
UTG folds, Hero calls $2, 3 folds, Villain #2 calls, 2 folds, Villain #1.

Flop: 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players, $7 pot)
V1 bets $10, Hero calls, V2 raises all-in, V1 calls $64 more, Hero contemplates for a long time and decided to call $63 all-in.

Main Pot: $225
Side Pot: $2

keikiwai · #2 10-23-2006, 05:19 PM

push after v1

i don't play live, so idk about pf

ViolentGandhi · #3 10-23-2006, 05:27 PM

You have $75 and a $2BB? That's pretty short, and if there's any preflop raising going on, I muck this hand. If it's a limpfest, I don't mind it too much, but I still lean towards folding.

However the call on the flop is fine, just pray your flush draw is not dominated.

Jay Riall · #4 10-23-2006, 05:29 PM

I don't play FR or live, but I'm pretty sure this is a fold pf. Definitely shove the flop the first time it gets to you. Flatcalling is a crime.

Hince · #5 10-23-2006, 05:44 PM

Fold this preflop, calling is terrible. Playing suited connectors is fine with postion if you are deep. However, you are not deep, and you position sucks.

After v1 bets, you should push the flop. Based on your read, at least one of your draw is probably live, so call.

AlienBoy · #6 10-23-2006, 06:52 PM

My guess is that this was at The Hustler Casino, right?

I play this game a bit - here are some thoughts.

Preflop is probably okay - though I often toss these OOP - if you sense that you're not going to get raised behind. You were fortunate that there were few callers - if all had called, V2 might have gone over the top PF.

On the flop: You've already indicated that V2 is acting the bully - and in this hand he has position to do so. He could easily have squat - very read/tell dependent.

V1's initial overbet may be 2 overcards, or any single pair, trying to protect his hand.

Your flat call is wrong, IMO. With V2, who you already know to be a bully, yet to act behind you, you want to make it wrong for him to call. If you push all in you will probably take the pot right there, if you raise to $25 or so, V1 still may call, V2 may fold - or may call - but he's not likely to go all in without a real hand based on your strong action. Your flat call could have easily induced a bluff from V2.

V1's subsequent call all in indicates that he may have a top pair, or a decent draw - and may just be tired of being run over by V2, and is calling what he things is a bluff, and is most likely expecting YOU to fold.

Getting better than 2 to 1 from the pot, I think your final call is correct.

BTW - did you get the 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]? Or did you get stacked?

AB

PS: Next time at Hustler, if you happen to see a tall guy with a Marvin the Martian card protector at Hustler, say " 'sup bro".

loveminuszero · #7 10-23-2006, 06:55 PM

after v1 bets $10 on the flop there's no real point in doing a normal raise of more than half your stack so you should probably push all-in.

ViolentGandhi · #8 10-23-2006, 07:25 PM

Results?

Grizwold · #9 10-23-2006, 08:46 PM

[ QUOTE ]
You have $75 and a $2BB? That's pretty short, and if there's any preflop raising going on, I muck this hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

The minimum/maximum buy-in at the table was $50 with $1/$2 blinds, and I had been there no longer than 25 minutes. It was interesting to me that only 3 people had me covered after such short time. There was relatively frequent preflop raising going on, about 1/3 pots were raised preflop to usually $5. I never saw any raise more than $10 preflop, and those raises were only by me. Ok, I'm starting to get the idea about preflop play in SSNL.

Grizwold · #10 10-23-2006, 09:01 PM

[ QUOTE ]
After v1 bets, you should push the flop. Based on your read, at least one of your draw is probably live, so call.

[/ QUOTE ]

In fact I considered raising all-in after V1 lead the flop for $10. I was not sure I was ahead of V1 at this point, but I had second pair, a gutshot and 4-flush, so I determined I had a reasonably high chance of improving to best hand if I'm behind to TPGK or even 2 pair. But I was not sure I was over a 50% favorite to end up ahead of V1's betting range. So I considered if I called and V2 called, I may be gettin correct odds to draw here. (You can see my limit tendencies here, please help taylor my play to NL strategies.) But my reads lead me to conclude this was the type of situations V2 would likely raise all-in with. He often bet all-in on flops that contained $20+ in them. If I raised all-in at first chance on the flop, I thought it was quite unlikely V2 would call and maybe neither would call, but would that be most beneficial to me? I checked, hoping V2 would call, or if he raised all-in, that V1 would also call, laying me 2.5:1 or a little less. Fortunately, when V2 raised all-in as I suspected he might, V1 called rather quickly, however I still found myself making a tough decision (for me anyway), even though this is what I was expecting and sort of hoping for. I was scared of flush domination, and I also feared if I was behind to 2-pair or a set, the cards I would need to improve may offer my other opponents redraws. I thought about it for a long time by limit standards (about 45 seconds lol). I did figure some draws I had were live, but I was not sure which ones, and whether my live draws were laying me good enough odds to call in this situation. Based on these kinds of reads was my flop call right in order to induce an all-in from at least one of my opponents, or does the call risk too much and fail to protect a robust (or not?) draw.