Fossil Fuel Burning Automobile, A Great Invention or Not?

adios · #1 10-20-2006, 04:32 PM

Since fossil fuel emissions are destroying the atmosphere and thus the planet then I guess we'd have to say that the automobile was a disasterous invention wouldn't we? Perhaps "destroying" is the wrong word. Discussion would be appreciated.

QuadsOverQuads · #2 10-20-2006, 04:45 PM

I would consider it a great invention. So many things that we enjoy today would never have been possible without the ease of transportation that this technology created.

(Do I lose my tree-hugging-hippie credentials now? [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img])

q/q

adios · #3 10-20-2006, 04:52 PM

No you're still cool [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]. Apparently continued use of fossil fuel burning autos will be the downfall of mankind. I'm being serious about this btw. I guess auto's have been a great invention but mankind has reached the point where new technology is desparately needed. I couldn't imagine not having an automobile at my disposal therefore going back to a horse and buggy is unfathomable to me.

John Feeney · #4 10-20-2006, 04:58 PM

adios,

I'd say it was a great invention, but one which became a serious problem once the population of drivers reached a certain point. (And that correlates with population growth in general.) I assume some smaller number of autos could have continued to operate sustainably, at least with regard to emissions and their impact on climate/environment.

Borodog · #5 10-20-2006, 05:04 PM

I would just like to note that the automobile would never have been any kind of problem at all without massive government subsidization of the highway system. The state-funded highway system has all but killed rail shipment in favor of free or nearly free highway trucking, and massively subsidizes high pollution low mileage traffic congestion in and around cities. Urban commuters pay about 5% in gas taxes of the actual costs of the highway system, which massively subsidizes automobile usage in congested urban areas. This creates massive traffic jams and a resulting tremendous waste of fuel and far greater pollution than would otherwise occur.

morphball · #6 10-20-2006, 05:15 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I would just like to note that the automobile would never have been any kind of problem at all without massive government subsidization of the highway system. The state-funded highway system has all but killed rail shipment in favor of free or nearly free highway trucking, and massively subsidizes high pollution low mileage traffic congestion in and around cities. Urban commuters pay about 5% in gas taxes of the actual costs of the highway system, which massively subsidizes automobile usage in congested urban areas. This creates massive traffic jams and a resulting tremendous waste of fuel and far greater pollution than would otherwise occur.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with this. How much of this world has been paved? This also kills undergraound aquifers and causes immense erosion and pollution (on top of exhaust).

Down with roads!

Troy Smith · #7 10-20-2006, 07:03 PM

I can't think of an invention that has saved as many lives and improved the lives as others as the internal cumbustion engine, even in a worst case global warming society.

Zeno · #8 10-20-2006, 07:23 PM

Nothing better than an American Muscle Car that gets 8 mph.

The auto and the internal combustion engine (which by the way can also run on LPG, peanut oil, and steam etc) were handed to man by Prometheus. It is a gift from God.

Without the fossil fuel burning orgy industrial society would not have developed. And it is important. Otherwise how could an overweight slob in Kansas City have fresh saltwater swimp for dinner, all because of fossil fuels, to accompany his fine wine and impress his trophy wife or mistress. This is civil, industrially society at its epitome.

-Zeno

Borodog · #9 10-20-2006, 08:38 PM

Mmmm. Delicious fresh saltwater swimp.

John Feeney · #10 10-20-2006, 09:23 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I would just like to note that the automobile would never have been any kind of problem at all without massive government subsidization of the highway system. The state-funded highway system has all but killed rail shipment in favor of free or nearly free highway trucking, and massively subsidizes high pollution low mileage traffic congestion in and around cities. Urban commuters pay about 5% in gas taxes of the actual costs of the highway system, which massively subsidizes automobile usage in congested urban areas. This creates massive traffic jams and a resulting tremendous waste of fuel and far greater pollution than would otherwise occur.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's pretty close to the theme of the movie, The End of Suburbia, though its emphasis is more on the fuel consumption necessitated by suburban living -- a result of the suburbs having been enabled by the highway system.

It may be a stretch, though, to say that without that, "the automobile would never have been any kind of problem at all." With continued exponential population growth here and in places like India and China, with their rising standards of living, I'd be surprised if auto emissions weren't a large problem even without a highway system of the sort we have.

Even if we had been able to delay the problems now attributed to the automobile, with world population projected (albeit speculatively) to grow by at least another 40% (large PDF) over the next 70 years, it seems that, barring the development of alternatives, we'd sooner or later be dealing with environmental problems attributable to the automobile.