Outsourcing call centers to India

[tuq]

Among the myriad posters that are on this forum, can anyone explain why this is big enough ROI to compel companies to do it?

Backstory: this morning I had to call my ISP as they effed something up. I get a chick named "Sandra", name in quotes because it's clear they give them whitey names, presumably to fool the majority of people who aren't aware of this development. "Sandra" addressed my problem acceptably but wanted to charge me $15 for a change to my account. When I bitched about this she didn't understand what I was saying - despite talking to her in that annoying "if I talk loudly and slowly maybe this foreigner will understand WTF I am saying" kind of way that American tourists do overseas. Instead, she started reading to me from some script to pitch me some antivirus protection. I told her I'm already rolling with Norton AV, she either didn't understand this or played dumb because she continued her pitch.

PRO: they pay their people pennies on the dollar compared to the $9-11/hr call center people here tend to make

CONS: it has to be expensive as hell to implement, hire people who understand English, train them, etc. And on top of all that they risk pissing off the customer because the rep may not understand the issue at hand. Plus cultural issues are no doubt a factor.

If anyone has insight into why this is such a great idea, I'd like to hear it.

[IggyWH]

HUH?

Have you tried restarting your computer?

[Dementia]

I was reading about this a couple of months ago, Dell does the same thing. An executive from Dell basically said they'd rather "pay some poor foreign man 50 cents an hour to feed his family for the week rather than some 18 yo American intern $20/hr to waste on Budweiser."

[econophile]

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PRO: they pay their people pennies on the dollar compared to the $9-11/hr call center people here tend to make

[/ QUOTE ]
you've got the pros right.

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CONS: it has to be expensive as hell to implement, hire people who understand English, train them, etc. And on top of all that they risk pissing off the customer because the rep may not understand the issue at hand. Plus cultural issues are no doubt a factor.

[/ QUOTE ]
You are overestimating the costs. While some large companies may actually set up their own call centers in India, most will truly outsource in the sense that they hire another company to handle their customer service calls. This company is likely already working for several other american clients, so they have the needed technologies and logistics in place. So it is not too expensive to serve an additional client.

English speakers are also abundant in India. It is common for Indians to pay for English classes in hope of landing a job in some kind of outsourcing operation. Currently the supply of capable English speakers exceeds the number of outsourced jobs.

I also think you underestimating how frustrating it can be to talk to a typical American customer service representative.

[Dementia]

Yeah, lets not forget how many times you call Dell (India), and the call is lost before you're connected and you need to wait all over again. It's not very sophisticated. And sure some Indians are very intelligent but when the language differences are so vast and they're like reading out of the book to you it can become extremely irritating. If an Indian is fluent in English (should be required), I've got no problem with it.

[guids]

I love it when they try to be whitey:

Me: Hi, Im having trouble with my mp3 player, its defective.

Apu: Oh, yes, I can help you with that

Me: Im sorry, Im having trouble understanding you, is there anyone that speaks better english

Apu: OH! Im from OHIO!, go BUCKEYES!

Me: huh? wtf? just put someone on who can speak english well enough that I dont get confused

Apu: Oh, GO OHIO!.

[tuq]

econ, the whole "outsourcing to an outsourcing company" is a great point I totally whiffed on. Plus your additional points were informative. Thanks.

Iggy, those links were awesome. Especially the second one. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Sponger.]

[ QUOTE ]
An executive from Dell basically said they'd rather "pay some poor foreign man 50 cents an hour to feed his family for the week rather than some 18 yo American intern $20/hr to waste on Budweiser."

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I highly doubt an executive at dell "basically" said that.

[Arnfinn Madsen]

I sold the infrastructure, communication etc. to establish such call centres in Norway, Sweden and Denmark; and had many discussion with managers at different companies regarding how to run a callcenter etc. etc., so I know the business very well in general. However this is mainly a UK/US-issue due to the widespread knowledge of English in India, it hasn't caught on any big scale in other European countries, but from attending a conference in Britain and staying in touch with British colleguaes I have snapped up a few things. The three main points are this:

1. The main cost is labor
2. The main cost is labor
3. The main cost is labor

So, this provides a big incentives for different companies to attempt to locate in India as the potential gain is enormous, however many have failed for reasons like those you mentioned. They are however, getting better and better at it, i.e. a lot of the Indish professional call centers now require that key staff spend some months in Britain to get a basic grip of local culture. One development after the hype of relocating is also that most companies seem to acknowledge that they still need to have staff in the country they serve, so many of the British ones have now implemented a model where 1st or 2nd level support takes place in India (registering an address change etc. etc.) while more complex requests are escalated to 2nd/3rd level support in Britain. This business hasn't sort of settled yet, it is still in the learning phase, it is not enough people that has necessary qualifications and experience to guarantee that they can conduct such a relocation successfully, so many companies end up having to hire unqualified people to lead the relocation process, also a source for many potential failures.

[Dementia]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
An executive from Dell basically said they'd rather "pay some poor foreign man 50 cents an hour to feed his family for the week rather than some 18 yo American intern $20/hr to waste on Budweiser."

[/ QUOTE ]

I highly doubt an executive at dell "basically" said that.

[/ QUOTE ]

"An interesting byproduct of the GripeLog being open to anonymous posts is that I seem to have accumulated a pretty healthy collection of comments from posters purporting to be Dell employees in India and elsewhere around the world. Of course, I can't verify that they all actually were from Dell employees, but following the tone over time shows a trend that lends some verisimilitude to their statements.

Back about eighteen months ago, the comments started off pretty apologetic about the Dell support gripes readers were airing. A poster who said he or she had just resigned after six months with Dell support in Hyderabad said that Dell technicians would sometimes know right off that a problem required a replacement component, "but we are bound by company policy which prohibits us from dispatching components until we finish the script given us by Dell management," the poster wrote. "I basically felt really bad in situations wherein I had to make really old people open up their computers, and I did in fact meet people on the phone who would be in tears if we told them that they need to open their machines. But I want you people to know the level of pressure and stress a tech support guy has ... from the top management. You cannot even imagine our plight."

By less than a year ago, though, the tone had definitely changed a bit. "You have problems with page-cannot-be-displayed, cannot-connect-to-Internet, and blue screen errors?" a Panama-based Dell tech responded to a reader's description of support woes. "They are all Windows-related problems, and guess what? Dell is a hardware company. If you have problems with Windows not running properly, blame Microsoft and call them to fix it. But most users don't like to do that, because they charge money. Instead, they prefer to call Dell and blame Dell tech support and sales and customer service because they have problems with Windows."

Shortly thereafter another poster took an even more decidedly plague-on-all-your-houses approach. "I too am working in Dell tech support," the poster said, saying his job had been to route calls to the proper support group. "The great thing is that tomorrow is my last day here. Great because this by far has been one of the least gratifying and frustrating positions I have ever held. Yes, there are extensive and considerable problems with Dell tech support. Their outsourcing to India is not even the least of them. Every day is a continuous assault by absolutely clueless and irate customers and an ineffective phone-based support system that is enough to make anyone crack. I'm saying that it all sucks: Dell's systems and their support and the morons who purchase them ... So many times I've had to restrain myself from telling customers who are whining about what a piece their Dell is that, hey, guess you should've bought a Mac. Goodbye, Dell!"

More recently, a Dell support tech in Mumbai, India had his own gripes for people who gripe about offshore support. "Honestly, I don't like Dell as a company, at least most of the time, because of their policies and other stuff that affects my job," the tech wrote. "But when it comes to computers, you are the worst people to deal with. I don't blame other people whom I've spoken with who don't know much about computers, especially your old folks, they're cool and sweet people. And they admit that they don't know hell about computers, which is my pleasure to educate them with some basics. They are not stupid; the REAL stupid people are like the ones who posted comments here. Hey, don't get mad at Dell because of your ignorance, c'mon ... And as for Dell and other companies outsourcing to Asia and costing you jobs, well you know what, Michael Dell and the rest would rather pay an Indian or a Panama guy 20 cents per hour that the guy will spend on feeding his family every day than an 18-year-old American intern 20 dollars per hour that he will spend on Budweiser in one night. Any company that wants to survive is doing the exact same thing. That is how it is and it will not change, so shut up and live with it."