2/4 EP AQs gets 3 bet Queen on the flop

ninenine_zoe · #1 10-12-2006, 08:26 AM

2/4 fullring 10 handed
semi loose table, flop seen rate between 35-40
Hero is in early position with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Hero raises, some folds, LMP coldcalls (very loose/bad player), some folds, BU 3bets, blinds folds, Hero + LMP calls.

flop: Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (10.5 SB)
Hero checks, LMP checks, BU bets, Hero raises, LMP folds, BU 3bets, Hero calls.

turn: A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (8.25 BB)
Her0 [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

no special reads on the button. mostly unremarkable (non-donkish), some raising preflop, maybe a tight aggressive player.
whats your line and why?

do you like the flop CR?
afterwards i was thinking about a flop donk to trap LMP (i think he would have called 1 bet w/ every hand - but to be honest, i thought he would call 2 bets with every hand too).

Gazzbut · #2 10-12-2006, 10:20 AM

I like the flop c/r. 3 handed its almost certain button will bet after his 3 bet preflop and you are ahead alot here.

Its almost tempting to go for it again on the turn but I think you have to bet as theres too much chance of him checking behind here.

James. · #3 10-12-2006, 10:41 AM

i likely cap preflop unless button is a tight passive player. even then i may still cap. either way, really. i like your flop play. the pot is big enough that we want to protect our hand from straight draws, etc. i would just bet the turn, i think. if he has KK he may get scared, if he has AK he may raise [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]. if he only calls that's a spot i occasionally go for a c/r on the river if he is TAGgy. many TAGs will have a tough time not valuebetting KK or AK in that spot. if he isn't a solid valuebettor, just lead the river as well.

ninenine_zoe · #4 10-12-2006, 11:53 AM

i thought about a cap preflop (coming from 6max its an easy cap). if there had been a chance LMP would drop i would have capped. also any pair i raise preflop in early position i would mostly cap 3-way.
since button looks somewhat reasonable (i think he is somewhat position aware), i put him on TT+, AQs+, AK. after he 3 bets my CR i put him on QQ+, AQ. i think its a very bad play to 3 bet AK in this spot vs an early position preflopraiser and flop CR. vs this range i should c/c down or b/c turn, c/c river. is this to nitty? (i see there is only one combo of AA and QQ left and some more of KK)

n.s. · #5 10-12-2006, 01:31 PM

If you can safely put him on QQ+, AQ after the 3-bet, then you have 62% equity. If we ignore the AQ possibility, you are beating 6 ways he can have KK, and losing to 2 ways he can have AA or QQ, making you are 75% favorite.

Point is, there's no reason to slow down until he starts to show more strength.

ninenine_zoe · #6 10-12-2006, 02:04 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Point is, there's no reason to slow down until he starts to show more strength.

[/ QUOTE ]

would you bet the turn or try to CR the turn?
should BU bet KK when checked to?
is there value in a CR? i think he should fold KK to a CR and would 3 bet me with QQ, AA, AQ.
would he call me down with KK or KQ if i donk the turn?

mrcunningham · #7 10-12-2006, 02:10 PM

grunch
PF-okay with no reads, if BU is known LAG consider 4-bet if that's the cap.
flop-I would prefer leading out and calling the raise.
turn-I'd consider bet/fold here, as I can't see what he raises you with that doesn't have you beat, and since you'd likely call if you checked, anyway.

KurtSF · #8 10-12-2006, 02:38 PM

[ QUOTE ]
vs this range i should c/c down or b/c turn, c/c river. is this to nitty? (i see there is only one combo of AA and QQ left and some more of KK)

[/ QUOTE ]

I would b/c turn and if raised c/c river, but if called b/c river too if its not a scare card.

Couldn't 99 be played this way too? What about JTs (from a position aware oponent who is getting a little out of line)? I think QQ+ and AQ might be a bit narrow a range. But either way I'm not folding top 2 here.

unterfish · #9 10-13-2006, 06:07 PM

[ QUOTE ]
If you can safely put him on QQ+, AQ after the 3-bet, then you have 62% equity. If we ignore the AQ possibility, you are beating 6 ways he can have KK, and losing to 2 ways he can have AA or QQ, making you are 75% favorite.

Point is, there's no reason to slow down until he starts to show more strength.

[/ QUOTE ]

I do not understand this calculation. I think there are 12 ways (4 * 3) he has kings. He has 4 ways he has AQ and 2 ways he has queens. Plus, he also has 2 ways for aces. Plus, AQ is only a tie. Therefore, you have 12 ways to beat him, 4 ways to tie, 4 ways to be beaten. Hence, you have a total of almost 75% equity.
Is there a flaw in my calculation?

Ricks · #10 10-13-2006, 10:17 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I do not understand this calculation. I think there are 12 ways (4 * 3) he has kings. He has 4 ways he has AQ and 2 ways he has queens. Plus, he also has 2 ways for aces. Plus, AQ is only a tie. Therefore, you have 12 ways to beat him, 4 ways to tie, 4 ways to be beaten. Hence, you have a total of almost 75% equity.
Is there a flaw in my calculation?

[/ QUOTE ]

There are only 6 possible combinations of KK, or any other pair.

There is only one way that he can have pocket aces and one way to have pocket queens since hero has one of each and there is one of each on the board.