How smart does one need to be...

[jokerthief]

...to get a masters degree or PhD in Statistics? How many people out of 100 simply don't have a high enough IQ to get a masters degree? How about a PhD?

[Darryl_P]

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...to get a masters degree or PhD in Statistics? How many people out of 100 simply don't have a high enough IQ to get a masters degree? How about a PhD?

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I'm in a pretty good position to answer this one since my mother was a professor of statistics for 35 years and was on various committees that decided whether or not someone gets a PhD. She also got involved socially with those types, travelled together with them, had them over at our house etc.

So as a result I've met hundreds of advanced degree holders in stats.

In my own independent adult life I've also met hundreds of business people and professional gamblers.

Comparing the three groups IQ-wise, the most impressive by far are the pro gamblers. I'd estimate the stats people averaged around 115-120. Same for the business people (I'm talking middle management and above). But the pro gamblers easily have at least 10 points on both groups, probably more like 15.

So to answer your question, I'd say roughly 50% of the general population doesn't have a high enough IQ for it.

The next 20% would have to work extra hard but could still do it.

The next 20% could do it with a normal amount of effort.

The top 10% could do it with relatively little effort, although there is a minimum level below which you can't really go, so at the very highest IQ levels, the question arises as to what motivates the person to take on so much drudgery.

[southerndog]

Oh man, this is CLASSIC!!

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I'm in a pretty good position to answer this one since my mother was a professor of statistics for 35 years and was on various committees that decided whether or not someone gets a PhD. She also got involved socially with those types, travelled together with them, had them over at our house etc.

So as a result I've met hundreds of advanced degree holders in stats.



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and

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I'd estimate the stats people averaged around 115-120.


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and

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So to answer your question, I'd say roughly 50% of the general population doesn't have a high enough IQ for it.


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LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

U obviously didn't take after your mom...

[Darryl_P]

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LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

U obviously didn't take after your mom...

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Uhhh...so you don't think it's possible to have participation rates from the 4 groups that are consistent with my statements that yield an average IQ among the participants of 115-120??

The difference between me and my mom is that she enjoyed elaborating on basic concepts so even the dumbest students in the class might get it eventually. My patience is much more limited.

[madnak]

I've heard that the average IQ among PhDs is 120. Assuming that's accurate (seems reasonable and matches Darryl's estimate), you'd probably want to be >1 standard deviation to be "smart enough." So maybe 16% of the population (assuming a normal distribution). But there's a lot more to consider than simple IQ. I'm sure someone with IQ 110 could get the degree if he worked hard and had good connections etc, while a person of 150 IQ might fail at the program due to mental illness or poor work ethic or whatever.

[agent_fish]

[ QUOTE ]
Oh man, this is CLASSIC!!

[ QUOTE ]

I'm in a pretty good position to answer this one since my mother was a professor of statistics for 35 years and was on various committees that decided whether or not someone gets a PhD. She also got involved socially with those types, travelled together with them, had them over at our house etc.

So as a result I've met hundreds of advanced degree holders in stats.



[/ QUOTE ]

and

[ QUOTE ]
I'd estimate the stats people averaged around 115-120.


[/ QUOTE ]

and

[ QUOTE ]

So to answer your question, I'd say roughly 50% of the general population doesn't have a high enough IQ for it.


[/ QUOTE ]


LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

U obviously didn't take after your mom...

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What he was saying actually made sense if he's saying the top 30-50% would have to work very hard for it. This would be from about 100-112 IQ.

[southerndog]

You guys, are sooooooooooooo off based..

Do you guys have any idea what the percentage of students is that fail, withdraw, or get a "d" in freshman calculus? its like 30%. Now, consider that these students get accepted to college, where perhaps only 40% of those who apply get accepted, when maybe only 50% of HS consider applying to such schools.. (These numbers are all being generous.) And these are the students who consider themselves "math types", etc... Then you're going to try and say the %age who can get an advanced degree, where they'll actually be expected to think, and do things like advanced calc, real analysis, math stats, etc... is some where like 50%, 20%????????

You have NO clue what the general population looks like.

[madnak]

Based on intelligence. Like I said, there's much more to it.

But only 40% of people can get accepted to college? And that only represents 50% of high school students? And only "math types" take freshman calc?

Your assumptions are way off base. Much more than 20% of the population goes to college, calc is a requirement for a wide variety of majors, and few of the people getting Ds or Fs consider themselves "math people." Also based on my experiences so far, college is both a "make or break" kind of scenario and is based at least as much on work as it is on brains.

[southerndog]

I should have included that those numbers were from a university that I taught at.

Let me add that the acceptance rate is closer to 30%, and I am of course referring to calculus for engineers and scientists which is the only calc. course that would apply since we're talking about future statisticians.

My point is this.. It ends up being a small percentage OF these entering freshman students that pass calculus. Now, OF the WHOLE population of 18 year olds, this number is of course EVEN SMALLER.

When I was in HS, by the time we were seniors, in a class of 250, there were 30 students who took either AP Calc, or Calc, but not AP. This is roughly 10%. Now, figure we lost 60 or so idiots who either dropped out, or went to vocational school.. This is less than 10%. Now, of those I went to school with , I would say maybe 15 of them could have gotten a stat degree. This is about 5%.

[Darryl_P]

You're assuming that lack of intelligence is the main reason why people drop out or don't complete the programs. I'm assuming it's mainly lack of discipline or lack of interest.