I'm so Bad with good hands OOP

DLizzle · #1 09-23-2006, 06:32 PM

This is my second hand at the table and I don't know any of the players. Lately I can't seem to get paid playing my big hands aggressively, so I go ahead and play this one like a girl. I'm thinking a lead out would be good at some point, but not sure.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 handed) internettexasholdem.com

CO ($410.06)
Button ($327.10)
Hero ($396)
BB ($150)
UTG ($86)
MP ($556.90)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. Hero posts a blind of $2.
2 folds, CO raises to $10, Button raises to $16, Hero (poster) calls $14, 1 fold, CO calls $6.

Flop: ($52) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, CO checks, Button bets $20, Hero calls $20, CO calls $20.

Turn: ($112) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, CO checks, Button bets $20, Hero raises to $60, CO calls $60, Button folds.

River: ($252) 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets $200, CO folds.

Final Pot: $452

Morrek · #2 09-23-2006, 06:50 PM

Wow. Bet or c/r flop. Bet or c/r turn(a REAL raise, like 140$)

rsliu · #3 09-23-2006, 08:21 PM

bet turn, bet river.

OMGTILTING · #4 09-23-2006, 08:22 PM

bet flop, bet turn, bet river

Hattifnatt · #5 09-23-2006, 10:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
bet flop, bet turn, bet river

[/ QUOTE ]

Megenoita · #6 09-23-2006, 08:57 PM

There are different ways to play this hand. You don't NEED to bet out on the flop, nor c/r it. You could use several lines, but I want to address your thinking.

Whenever you have close to the nuts, your desire should be to want to get paid as much as you can by what you think they probably or might have (that would pay you). See, in this hand, you should hope someone has a T (AT/KT preferably) or an OESD (J9). If they have 2p or better, they will let you know, and you'll get it all in no matter how you play it. Now when they have TP or an OESD, how should you proceed? Well, c/r'ing is a good idea for the flop (in case no one has anything, you get that one bet, plus if they do, it's a good way to build the pot). Your c/r should be relatively small on this board. The only hand with really any outs against you is J9. So I would c/r a little over 2x, and at most 3x the bet (assuming the bet is a respectable size). Then you will follow through on the turn and river with 3/4 size bets. If anyone ever makes 2p, you'll get it all in. If not, you'll win a nice-sized pot.

Your problem in this hand is that you didn't realize how to build the pot. It's absolutely fine to slowplay on the flop here, like you did. So let's pretend you took that line (even though it's usually best to c/r the flop to build the pot now). On the turn, here is where you need to really build the pot. Given that villain bet tiny, the same size as his flop bet, he probably has less than TP or TP with a weak kicker. Even so, you gotta raise a meaningful amount and hope he or the other guy has something they can call you with (maybe the 3rd guy had T7, 56, Ah8h). So given the $20 bet on the turn, raise pot or a little under pot, and really make them make a decision. Think of it this way-if they have less than TP, you're not going to win much, anyway. If they have a strong draw or TP + some draw, they will be hard pressed to fold. And your river bet can be proportional to the pot.

The best way to play it is usually to c/r the flop smallish, then bet the turn and river close to pot. You could have just TP, so it's hard for another TP to fold. Raising the turn will fold more hands that might call down the other line.

Overall, just think in terms of what they can have that will pay you, and what likelihood it is that they have those hands. Then pursue a route that will be most profitable.

bheinima · #7 09-23-2006, 09:08 PM

You need to completely change your way of thinking of how to handle monsters, regardless of whether you're in position or not. Instead of slow playing and trying to get opponent to hit a hand or make a bluff, be aggressive and hope that your opponent has alrady caught a portion of the flop (and thinks a big bet means you're FOS) or is willing to put money in there on a draw. Otherwise, get used to winning a lot of small pots and losing a few big ones. Winning lots of small pot and losing a few big ones = terrible when talking about flopped sets.

In this hand, get some money in there on the flop. Any 7 or 9 can give an opponent a better hand or will totally kill your action. You need to lead for at least 2/3 pot or check-raise a real amount, to at least $80.

On the turn, lead or C/R to a much bigger amount.

Finally, given the way you've played the hand, if I'm villain, it's completely transparent that you slow-played a huge hand when you bet that much on the river and I would fold AA here in a heartbeat...

DLizzle · #8 09-23-2006, 10:22 PM

ty for last two posts, these situations bring out the worst in me and I have trouble with the logic. I usually play them more aggressively, but I still have trouble. I think I should lead out more. I have this habit of almost always checking to the aggressor with any type of hand. I really should bet out, because when a donk does it to me I usually think they have [censored] and usually raise.

ahnuld · #9 09-23-2006, 10:30 PM

slowplaying sucks in general. CR flop is fine. Calling is pretty bad, but once you did, I like a turn lead for 3/4 pot.

bet2win · #10 09-23-2006, 11:58 PM

bet out on the flop, the board is too drawy to f around with

I'd bet $45 and hope button has an overpair and raises

On the turn? what is with the nancy raise, you are asking for trouble