The passivity trap

[Ryno]

I don't play high-stakes live too often but every now and then I do, and every time people read me as weak-tight. I work this to my advantage for a while until I get caught bluffing or call down with A-high or something and then everything proceeds normally. I show up infrequently enough that the pattern has proceeded this way for some time.

So today I am playing 4 handed 1-2, and I raise AJo on the button. The BB, "Freddie" for those who know the twins at Commerce, 3bets. I call, and he dark-bets the flop.

The flop is J97 rainbow.

The problem here, the "passivity trap" if you will, is that if I raise this flop, Freddie will put me on exactly what I have, and it will be unlikely for him to make an error postflop. I'm much better off if our first confrontation is an Ace high board and I have an OESD or something.

On that flop though it's just bad poker to just call though so I raised, and he 3bet. At some point I have to consider what he thinks of me and how much action he has now given me - has that happened yet? Should I 4bet here? Just call down?

[mc123]

um.. call and see the turn? i don't see why you would ever 3bet if he thinks your passive

[Kayber2]

You may want to consider raising more flops. I dont' know the villain in this hand but if he's capable of 3 betting small pairs, AQ, or AK here then folding on the flop I'm raising QT here and KQ.

Since you raised the flop and he 3 bet I generally call down ESPECIALLY if I'm viewed as weak/tight.

[HiatusOver]

"On that flop though it's just bad poker to just call though so I raised"

I dont agree with this at all, why is calling this flop unacceptable?

[mike l.]

i think you shouldve 4 bet preflop.

as played i think calling the flop and raising ANY turn card is a good play, as well as just raising the flop.

when youre 3 bet by him there it's definitely a concern because he himself is actually a little weak tight and cautious postflop. you should proceed with caution and start calling at this point, but bet if checked to..

i like my first line better of raising the turn.

[Ryno]

"why is calling this flop unacceptable?"

Well I do not know this opponent super well, but the most common leak among the better players in this game is that they give too much action on the flop. If I am ahead my best chance to extract value is right away - at least this is what I was thinking when I wrote "bad poker".

[Ryno]

Yeah, I guess this isn't that interesting of a hand - I've wanted to write something for a while on how to work within a weak-tight image and at the time this hand felt like the right one. I was trapped into playing it passively because it was the hand he figured me to have, but playing it this way would only reinforce my weak-tight image for next time - that was kind of the point of the post title.

Anyway I put on my best "OMG what do I do with A7 here" and finally called the 3bet, then called the turn. The river he fired out real confident. It was one of those moments where you just know folding is the right move, if you trust yourself at all to read people's body language. But I had been acting weak so he could feel that confident about TT, who knows.

I called and he rolled QQ.

[TomBrooks]

[ QUOTE ]
The problem here, the "passivity trap" if you will, is that if I raise this flop, Freddie will put me on exactly what I have, and it will be unlikely for him to make an error postflop.

[/ QUOTE ]
You can use this to your advantage also, no?

Raise and if he three bets you know he has AA-JJ and can fold. If he calls your're pretty sure he's slowplaying. Take a free card on the turn and you might improve. Then only if he has AA or JJ are you screwed, but if he bets or checkraises on the river you will know that.

You forgo future profits but also limit future losses.

If he has TT or 88 he's not folding anyway, and if he has 99 or 77 your screwed.

There could be a problem if he has AJ which would chop and he three bets that, but that doesn't happen that often.