10-25 LIVE Borgreezy hand, bottom two vs. triplxxx from FTP

[dlpnyc21]

This hand has kind of extensive history.

I am sitting down around 2:30am on a Saturday morning, in a 4-handed 10/25 game at the Borgata. The previous night, I had taken a shot at a 25/50 6max game on FTP. There was a new player in the game who was pretty loose and playing somewhat unconventionally. He was killing durr, who was also in the game. I wasn't sure if he was getting lucky or what, but he had built a nice stack.

On the internet, I saw him min CR his draws and his monsters. He also had a propensity to bluff and show.

Here are the two relevant hands where he stacked me twice. Flame away on these hands, as advice regarding them is welcome in addition to advice on the hand in question.

Online Hand 1: He double-doozies me.
http://www.pokerhand.org/?494482as
This one was pretty gross. I don't think I can ever fold the flop to this player, he was very loose, probably a 38/12 with a 1 aggro factor. The turn mind boggles me, but I paid him off like a donkey. This hand should have been burned more prominently in my head when the relevant hand came up
I think the hand is ugly in a vaccuum, but I'm not sure I should have checked the turn, behind, I dunno, it confused me.

He called me with 9-high!!
http://www.pokerhand.org/?494510

He makes a strange limp reraise from the cutoff, and I cold call. The flop might be a lead, might be a raise, I'm not sure. On the turn I have a relatively straightforward semi-bluff spot, so I just shove it in. He tanks it and calls. I'm not sure what I think of my turn shove, but I didn't put him on much and hoped he'd lay down a weak hand.

THE HAND IN QUESTION+BACKGROUND:
We had been playing for a while, once it got shorthanded I turned up the aggression and am up like 3-4k. During this time, I get to chatting with a few people at the table about online poker, and one of them mentions that he just played last night for one of the first times on FTP and he won big, like 30k. I ask him his name and I realize it's triplxxx. The whole table is laughing, I ask him how he called the turn with 96, and he said he couldn't understand why a real hand would bet so much on the turn. He was right. The whole table finds it hilarious that we were both playing each other the night before then again the very next night in AC. We get to joking, he tells me he'd FT a wsop event which Jason Strasser ("some guy off the internet, good player") won. I know Jason didn't win but I imagine he busted out before he could figure out who won. He is joking about busting up some durr guy the night before, and how he was talking trash. The funny part was, after the 96cc hand, I had typed in the chat that I needed that money for tuition, joking around, and he told me later that he felt bad and he actually typed in "that sounds like a tough situation." Pretty random coincidence. He is a rich businessman, middle aged guy, clearly a recreational player who had just retired from his business and was living the life.

Anyways, I see the game is playing a bit passive, but the table is getting a bit fed up at my aggression. Also, I had just caught George (triplxxx) in a bluff.

I had raised 79o on the button and he had called from the blinds. Flop was 73x two diamonds he chks, i bet he calls. Turn blank, non-diamond, he chks I bet he calls. River is a 9d, making the flush, and he leads out for like 1100. I call he has A3cc. I know he is capable of bluffing marginal hands.

Anyways, this hand comes up. I have about 8.5-9kish to start the hand.
Comments on both the flop play and turn play are welcome.


Folds to me, I raise K4hh on the button. Yes, this is loose, and probably a preflop fold, but it's 4 handed and I wanted to have an aggro image.

George calls from the blinds.

Flop comes AxKc4c. He chks, I bet 200, he thinks for a bit then CRs to 600.
What do you guys like here? I am pretty sure I am ahead of his range. He had reraised all big hands preflop from what I've seen so I doubt he has AA, KK, AK. He could have 444 or A4 easily though. I put him on the nut flush draw. I called though, with the intention of reevaluating the river.
Do most people raise this flop this deep?


Turn is a red 5, the board is AxK4c5h.
He chks!! WTF? Should I have checked behind here? I'm not sure at all. I want to charge vs. a draw, and also get value from one pair+draw type hands that I beat.

So I think for a bit and decide to bet 1500.
Is this play terrrible? I felt sick when he CR'd AI.

At this point, there is a lot of $$ in the middle, I have two pair, and the red 5 did not figure to hurt me.

Do you guys call, or fold in this spot, given the entire history of the night and including the fact that I just called him down in a bluff like 10 minutes prior.

Thanks,
dlpnyc21













[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

[NT!]

He's probably got it here. A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. Sucks if he can do this with 54cc, I think I like a check back on the turn here.

NT

[Anderson1]

he's got you beat here at least half the time. he could also have AQ/AJcc here. i'd have three-bet flop. as played, fold.

[backdoorbet]

if he can do this with 54cc then ask the floor to count the deck.

this would be a great way for him to move you off of Ax no?

[Blizzardbaum]

A tough spot but I think this is a fold. On the flop, I think TP+NFD is very likely, but I don't think that hand c/r the turn also. Its a really weird line.

In addition to the hands you considered, I think you should add 2c3c.

I can't imagine that he thinks he has much FE against you as you've seen him make plays with very marginal hands and complete air before. That makes this all the more likely to be a value raise.

[NT!]

[ QUOTE ]
if he can do this with 54cc then ask the floor to count the deck.

fold. he wants a call.

[/ QUOTE ]

hehe oops

lol strategypostaments

NT

[CavMan]

i like a check behind on the turn and then be prepared to call almost any river bet.

i wouldn't bet the turn unless you wanted him to push.

[dlpnyc21]

Forall the people saying chk the turn...You saw what he was capable with in the 96 hand (meaning calling on draws), there are so many hands, including the nut flush draw, that will call a turn bet but not a river bet. I think I am missing a ton of value if I don't bet this turn against this particular player, no?

[AceCR9]

what about re-raising the flop? you have 2 pair vs. a LAG player 4 handed. I think you'll see him fold a lot of hands there. agree with above- the double C/R is normally a big hand. don't bet turn unless you are going to call.

Problems with calling AI- I don't see that he has anything your way ahead of, and you could be drawing very slim.

looks like AcXc more than anything. maybe A5cc.

[Man of Means]

[ QUOTE ]
I think I am missing a ton of value if I don't bet this turn against this particular player, no?

[/ QUOTE ]

Just a thought - but you could consider the check to have value in inducing a river bluff from an opponent with such a tendency. So you are often going to get that $1100 on the river when the draw misses/he bluffs and save money when the draw comes in or you are already beat.

I suspect you are beat when he c/r AI. Based on the history it seems like a case of a smaller failed bluff setting up a big bet with a legitimate hand and you certainly don't have odds to find out if it's not.