KK overpair reraised on flop

dfan · #1 09-09-2006, 01:39 PM

(First hand post on this forum.)

$10 PokerStars Rebuy. My stack is above average, 278 left, 135 cash. I've only played 1 orbit at table. All I know about villain is that he has open raised twice from ep and mp and won the blinds and is the big stack at the table.
a)What hands should I put villain on?
b)Is this a clear fold, a clear call (pushing my 10k extra in), or close decision?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t1200 (9 handed) internettexasholdem.com

UTG (t46493)
Hero (t46043)
MP1 (t31325)
MP2 (t27857)
MP3 (t27575)
CO (t20665)
Button (t68457)
SB (t2975)
BB (t42248)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
1 fold, Hero raises to t3600, 4 folds, Button calls t3600, 2 folds.

Flop: (t7800) 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero bets t8400, Button raises to t31200, Hero ? ?

skier_5 · #2 09-09-2006, 01:48 PM

Why the flop overbet? That's just dumb. Bet like 5600 or something on the flop and play poker from there. As far as how it was played, I prolly just 3-bet all in since villian is all but committed. In those rebuys on stars you'll often see KQ or soething in addition to hands that beat you.

nath · #3 09-09-2006, 01:50 PM

i don't think i would ever not stick it in, although a set is somewhat worrisome

mornelth · #4 09-09-2006, 02:00 PM

1) do not overbet this flop. My standard bet here would be around K whether I hold KK, AA, JQ, QQ, 78s, 22...
2) 3-bet Push... You're behind JJ, QJ, 44 and I think you get raised by a lot more than that, including T9...

FortunaMaximus · #5 09-09-2006, 02:11 PM

The flop overbet isn't necessarily that dumb if it was intentional. Signals middle pair you ain't enthused about. This would get a raise from a lot of Q's and some drawing hands. Sets would suck, but, hey. He's might be trying to take it away from you on the flop, based on the preflop coldcall. You'd have to think JJ-QQ would at least reraise preflop, no?

Jersey Jim · #6 09-09-2006, 02:40 PM

All-in.

dfan · #7 09-09-2006, 03:38 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Why the flop overbet?

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry, flop pot should say 9675 (blinds were 600/1200/75). The hand converter didn't calculate the flop pot correctly and I didn't think to check it. So I bet about 85% of the pot. Think a 60% or so pot bet is better here? Honestly, I just didn't want to have him call since there were so many turn cards that would scare me if he pushed on the turn. Bad thinking?

dfan · #8 09-09-2006, 03:41 PM

Thanks for the feedback all. I just wanted to find out if my call was bad and I had donked off all my chips. Of course he had JJ and I was out but I feel better about my decision now.

dfan · #9 09-09-2006, 03:59 PM

On second thought there are some things about my play that I'm still uncomfortable about:

1. With my 46K stack and 3bb 3600 PFR aren't I giving everyone with a pp the right odds to call me if I'm going to reraise all in on any non-A flop? Seems like when my stack is 12 times a standard pfr I'm setting myself up to get stacked by sets, no?

2. What did my opponent likely put men on? Isn't it likely that he would strongly suspect I have an overpair given my ep raise and 85% flop bet into him when he had me more than covered? If so he couldn't expect me to reliably fold, so would he do this a pair or a straight draw? Should this "2nd level" thinking (if that is what it is) made me suspect a set?

skier_5 · #10 09-09-2006, 04:09 PM

[ QUOTE ]
On second thought there are some things about my play that I'm still uncomfortable about:

1. With my 46K stack and 3bb 3600 PFR aren't I giving everyone with a pp the right odds to call me if I'm going to reraise all in on any non-A flop? Seems like when my stack is 12 times a standard pfr I'm setting myself up to get stacked by sets, no?

2. What did my opponent likely put men on? Isn't it likely that he would strongly suspect I have an overpair given my ep raise and 85% flop bet into him when he had me more than covered? If so he couldn't expect me to reliably fold, so would he do this a pair or a straight draw? Should this "2nd level" thinking (if that is what it is) made me suspect a set?

[/ QUOTE ]

1)No you do not have to worry about giving a set improper odds in this situation because you do not always stack off.

2)meh, depending on your image and how he plays, he could have a few different ranges, but his ranges are still >set.