20/40 TT UTG.. river decision

Bill King · #1 09-07-2006, 05:10 PM

this hand is from a while back, but its still on my mind and driving me insane. I think I played it badly, but I kind of want to hear everybody's opinion.

Foxwoods 20/40 Holdem.

SB is an inexperienced player. I dont have that much info on him, but he seems like he is kind of out there and is pretty passive.

BB is "Machine Gun" Tommy. Friend of mine, plays pretty LAGGY at times and mixes up his play very well. We've played quite a big of hands together in the past year, so I feel I have a good read on his play and he always complains about how I run so well against him, but that's because i always have the best hand. he has a very high variance style of play.. and has been running horribly this session, and when he does, he tends to really force the action and literally give his chips away.

I have black TT and raise UTG. folded around to SB who cold-calls and BB who also calls.

flop comes 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

SB checks, tommy bets, i raise, SB cold calls, tommy 3-bets, I call, SB calls.

turn A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

SB checks, tommy bets, i raise, SB calls, tommy calls.

river A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

SB bets, tommy thinks and looks like he doesnt want to fold but does.. hero??

pot: 14BB.

Justin A · #2 09-07-2006, 05:24 PM

I think everything is played well up to the river, where I think a fold may be correct but it's a big pot and you don't know much about the small blind so I call.

cgrohman · #3 09-07-2006, 05:29 PM

Fine. Got to fold the river. What the heck are you beating?

Bill King · #4 09-07-2006, 05:38 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Fine. Got to fold the river. What the heck are you beating?

[/ QUOTE ]

thats what i asked myself when i was pondering what to do on the river. my initial reaction was to fold, but sometimes BB will make these whacky big folds (and shows me them someimes when im talking to him at the table or playing next to him) so i thought that there was reason for calling because now I have to beat 1 villain, who easily could be bluffing the missed flushy. theres no way to really read him here, it really puzzled me what he could have.

jba · #5 09-07-2006, 05:42 PM

well tommy really needs to fold almost everything that isn't an ace here as you are repping it hard and he he's going to end up paying more than one bet to see a showdown a lot of the time. he knows that much and it's not that surprising that he folded.

I think I try to pick him off here. SB would be really stupid to bluff here, but you said that's what he was so I'd make the call.

Bill King · #6 09-07-2006, 06:00 PM

[ QUOTE ]
well tommy really needs to fold almost everything that isn't an ace here as you are repping it hard and he he's going to end up paying more than one bet to see a showdown a lot of the time. he knows that much and it's not that surprising that he folded.

I think I try to pick him off here. SB would be really stupid to bluff here, but you said that's what he was so I'd make the call.

[/ QUOTE ]

tommy usually makes big folds against me b/c he thinks im a lot tighter than i actually am. mainly because every time we play together its a full ring 10-handed wild loose game, and changing gears doesnt really make a difference to people who dont pay attention. I almost always show the nuts in showdowns against him, and he definitly doesnt make wild crazy bluffs against ppl whom he likes i know that for sure. but when he folds the river, thats what really threw me off.

i am certaily changing gears here, and he basically thinks i am an un-thinking ABC bet the nuts type player (which is what i was when him and I started playing against eachother) and i read his turn bet for an isolation play for sure. but he also knows i respect position and dont really get out of line with hands in EP, so my hand certainly has more merit if i make him a believer, because as wild as he plays, he certainly can make laydowns and trusts his reads, like i do.

private joker · #7 09-07-2006, 06:07 PM

SB's play looks like a busted spade draw -- but unfortunately, if one of his spades is the A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], then you're dead anyway. I think a crying call is in order. Once in a while you'll be pleasantly surprised to see the bluff.

cgrohman · #8 09-07-2006, 06:08 PM

SB would need some brass balls to donk the river without an A (or maybe a 3) after that turn action. You also said he was a passive player. I can't find a call here.

Bill King · #9 09-07-2006, 06:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]
SB would need some brass balls to donk the river without an A (or maybe a 3) after that turn action. You also said he was a passive player. I can't find a call here.

[/ QUOTE ]

yeah exactly what i was thinking after i played the hand. it was just played so weak passive, i literally said out loud "would you seriously play an ace like that?" but he was so braindead i cant get a read off of someone who basically doesnt know how to answer your question.

Bill King · #10 09-07-2006, 06:23 PM

i debated and debated and then finally made the crying call waaa waaaa

villain showed me AJ and scooped. i then took a walk with tommy and he told me he had 10-3 offsuit in the BB.