trips getting action

[skillzilla]

SB berated me just the hand before for value betting my middle pair

i have KJ i mp3 and raise first one in SB and BB make the call
flop comes 85K, SB bets, BB calls, raisy daisy, they both call
turn is yet another king (rainbow board), SB bets BB calls, I raise, SB folds and BB reraises me...

[ESKiMO-SiCKNE5S]

easy cappucino?

call the river if donked with no improvement

[Fabian11]

What are the hands that beat you here? 88, 55, AK and KQ. I assume that we can rule out AK, because that would most probably have meant a 3 bet preflop. But it could have been slowplayed. Nevertheless I assume that you are sitting against one of the 3 other hands, which are absolutely worth a call preflop by the BB, if you are beat which is not sure. KJ, KT or Kx are likely holdings, because BB could put you on 88. Now I see that K8 a K5 would beat you as well. This is IMO the most likely holding. I assume that you should throw the 3 Ks away, but I would call and hope for the 3 outs on the river. Dependent on the read of BB I would call his bet, even if I do not improve. The pot is big enough.

[skillzilla]

so were putting BB on a slowplay or on tilt?

[Befolder]

[ QUOTE ]
What are the hands that beat you here? 88, 55, AK and KQ. I assume that we can rule out AK, because that would most probably have meant a 3 bet preflop. But it could have been slowplayed. Nevertheless I assume that you are sitting against one of the 3 other hands, which are absolutely worth a call preflop by the BB, if you are beat which is not sure. KJ, KT or Kx are likely holdings, because BB could put you on 88. Now I see that K8 a K5 would beat you as well. This is IMO the most likely holding. I assume that you should throw the 3 Ks away, but I would call and hope for the 3 outs on the river. Dependent on the read of BB I would call his bet, even if I do not improve. The pot is big enough.

[/ QUOTE ]
Folding this would be a disaster.

Call down from here at the very least.

[Jerboa]

Take the following with a HUGE grain of salt, because I am absolutely aweful at this game. =)

But...this seems to be a textbook flopped set at the micro limits. I've seen many players play AK this way as well. Calling PF because they're passive players. Check/calling to the raiser, and coming alive on the turn. Not so much a conscious slowplay, as just standard timid play by a micro-limit player. You're probably beat here. I would expect to see villain turn over 55 or 88 here, but not be surprised with AK or K8.

I'm not sure what you mean by tilt? What has happened recently to put him on tilt? If you mean he's reraising with nothing, it's possible I guess....but you've given no indication that he might be capable of making that play. What reads did you have on him? From what I've seen at these levels, this kind of action only has one meaning. Player thinks his hand is good, and it is very strong.

[Jerboa]

Sorry..wasn't clear above, but I would definately call it down.

[Befolder]

[ QUOTE ]
Take the following with a HUGE grain of salt, because I am absolutely aweful at this game. =)

But...this seems to be a textbook flopped set at the micro limits. I've seen many players play AK this way as well. Calling PF because they're passive players. Check/calling to the raiser, and coming alive on the turn. Not so much a conscious slowplay, as just standard timid play by a micro-limit player. You're probably beat here. I would expect to see villain turn over 55 or 88 here, but not be surprised with AK or K8.

I'm not sure what you mean by tilt? What has happened recently to put him on tilt? If you mean he's reraising with nothing, it's possible I guess....but you've given no indication that he might be capable of making that play. What reads did you have on him? From what I've seen at these levels, this kind of action only has one meaning. Player thinks his hand is good, and it is very strong.

[/ QUOTE ]

Jerboa, you've done a good job of pointing out the hands that beat the OP, but you haven't looked at the other side of the coin.

Many of us have seen the strangest cards showdown after the river in situations just like this.

Here are the other possible hands that a villain might do this with:

PPs 99-QQ
Any Kx, we're ahead of K2-K4,K6,K9-KT
perhaps any 8x, most of which we're ahead all but 8K.

If a flush draw or straight draw appears on the turn, some villains will even raise that.

It's read dependent, but I would also give a little credence to the tilt factor. Villain might think the OP is a terrible player because of the comment on the previous hand.

You need to start looking to not fold so quickly it sounds like. I remember when I was doing that, started calling more often instead of assuming my opponent had some ridiculously unbeatable hand.

What did I find out? I found out that at showdown, these guys were making plays with some ridiculous trash and taking down far more pots and leaving tables with far more money. It totally changed my view of what I was doing.

Don't be so quick to fold. Somebody find that link to Ed Miller's post about not folding top pair in these pots so much. It'd be a good read for Jerboa.

[Bona]

*grunch*

In my opinion you have to call down even though you are beat most of the time. On the bright side a jack could turn the tables for you as could a large runner runner pair. I can't find a raise or a fold. I suspect he is most likely K8 or K5.

[Jerboa]

Yah..sorry, I wasn't clear about that. I would definately call it down. By my estimation you're being offered ~6-1 odds on calling it down from here. Even with what I posted, I couldn't be confident enough that I am beat more than 14% of the time (Exactly because of the wierd hands, tilt, raising Kx thinking he's best).

I just meant that I expect to be beaten here, not that I would toss the hand. [img]/images/graemlins/crazy.gif[/img]

btw...my copy of Ed's book is very dogeared. I'm going through most of it again right now. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]