a couple spots to slowplay?

[mike l.]

both are live 100-200.

first hand: mediocre game KK in the bb. an expert (from what ive been told by a semi reliable source) who oftentimes plays 400-800 and so on, raises in emp. my image is decent and aggressive. should i be flat calling here some of the time? most of the time?

second hand: very good game. i get QQ on the button. a fishy bad player openraises in the cutoff he can be semilag, i 3 bet, blinds fold, he calls. the flop comes Q63 rainbow. he checks, should i check here sometimes? most of the time?

[baronzeus]

mike,

i flatcall in the BB there about 75% of the time.


the second hand, if he's fishy and bad, i'd bet it and see what he does. hoepfully he'll put in a raise somewhre.

[surfdoc]

I like a flat call in hand one maybe 50% but really base it a lot on other metagame aspects.

Hand two I just think you have to bet almost every time but you need to know a little more about how often he peels and how often he gets out of line. That board is so dry that he may take one off light or try to get frisky with a pocket pair. You are as good as anyone at reading him as the flop comes down. If he looks utterly disappointed I think giving him a card is okay. I have seen all hell break loose sometimes on the turn when he thinks you are on air and decides to bet/3 bet bluff.

Out of curiosity, do you ever bet the flop and check a blank turn? This seems like a fishy play but I have used it on occasion when my read is solid that a guy is folding.

[ILOVEPOKER929]

I would flat call against the good player close to 100% of the time. Deception has more value vs these type of players, certainly greater than 1 sb, IMO.

2nd hand: I would only check that flop vs a habitual bluffer who had no clue. So I would bet here 100% of the time vs this guy.

[andyfox]

Why do I suspect you know the answers to these questions better than most of the rest of us?

Hand 1, I find I'm flat calling most of the time. That's because I rarely have a monster here and am flat calling with less ipmresive holdings. One approach is to then check-call the flop and donk the turn, which they often suspect is a bluff.

Hand 2, they expect you to bet any flop, so I usually oblige as it doesn't give away the strength of my hand. Depending on the player, they might go into a shell if I check, suspecting a monster.

[worm33]

[ QUOTE ]
both are live 100-200.

first hand: mediocre game KK in the bb. an expert (from what ive been told by a semi reliable source) who oftentimes plays 400-800 and so on, raises in emp. my image is decent and aggressive. should i be flat calling here some of the time? most of the time?

second hand: very good game. i get QQ on the button. a fishy bad player openraises in the cutoff he can be semilag, i 3 bet, blinds fold, he calls. the flop comes Q63 rainbow. he checks, should i check here sometimes? most of the time?

[/ QUOTE ]


The first hand I would 3 bet a lot of the time against an expert player, if he was a bad player and I was going to be defending a lot I would just call.

Hand 2 I would be much more inclined to check if it came QJ6 instead of Q63 rainbow. When it comes QJ6 you can sell the fact that you have 77 or 88 or AK and you feel that flop hits his range a ton. Q63 he expects you to bet every flop and when you dont it might even give him warning signs.

[mike l.]

"One approach is to then check-call the flop and donk the turn, which they often suspect is a bluff."

it's interesting you think this is a bluff because i find it's almost always a made hand somewhere between weak and decent.

[mike l.]

with hand 1 i think it's a call too. it protects calls with weaker hands out of the blinds and you gain too much by deceiving a very good player letting their hand reading skills hang them. in the real hand i 3 bet and he called and when i bet the flop he folded.

in hand 2 i think a flop check is better. im a huge favorite against any hand and most of the time he's drawing completely dead. it's worth missing one small bet to try and turn this small pot into one with a little more meat. the most likely hand for a cutoff openraiser is Ax and that hand cant call this flop ever, but if i check he might feel compelled to see me at showdown or better yet take a shot at the pot. as i said in my other flop check thread, checking the flop in this game doesnt really indicate a monster to anyone. what actually happened is i bet and he flashed me an A and said "i wont chase you" and folded.

[Nate tha\\\' Great]

Strongly dislike both, but #1 more than #2. That's all I'm going to say since I'm happy to have you people keep playing this way against me.

[MattiasL]

Just a question about hand #1.

If you have been playing your normal (judging from your other posts) aggressive game, does the 3bet really give your opponent that much information?

If not, it seems the slowplay just loses money.