Should I have said something

mhcmarty · #1 08-11-2006, 03:12 PM

WSOP ME blinds at 50/100

First 2 or 3 to act limp and I looked down at JJ. With the blinds so low, 2 - 3 people in already and so many to act behind I decided to limp along. By the time it got to blinds there were at least 7 people in for $100. One of the blinds says raise and throws in a $1,000 chip. It's folded to me and I have to think for a bit (as I'm want to do) as I do, the people behind me start to fold and it's folded back to the raiser who thinks it's been folded all the way around. As he pushes his cards to the dealer (he's sitting right next to the dealer) I speak up and let the dealer know I still have cards and haven't acted. Another 2-3 seconds and his cards are mucked. I'm still not sure if I should have said anything as my cards were sitting in front of me with a card cap.

1. Should I speak up as soon as I see others playing out of turn
2. Speak up before the raisers cards are mucked
3. Not at all

Would #3 be angle shooting? Breaking a rule?

Thanks

popesc · #2 08-11-2006, 03:17 PM

1, although the dealer should be on top of things enough so that this never gets to the second person folding behind you.

XXXNoahXXX · #3 08-11-2006, 03:18 PM

n

NT! · #4 08-11-2006, 03:19 PM

You are obligated to protect your action, if you don't your opportunity to act can be killed or your hand can be ruled dead. I doubt it would happen in this case but it's your responsibility.

NT

ScottieK · #5 08-11-2006, 03:26 PM

I point out actions that are out of turn, whether I'm involved in the hand or not. I just say "time" or "it's his action" to the dealer and point out whose turn it should be to act. If it's my action, I do it as soon as I realize that people behind me are acting. I don't quite get why the raiser or the dealer in your example thought everyone folded to him if your cards were in plain view. I think you did what you should have done, but then why didn't the dealer or the player wake up and realize they were out of turn?

Also think #3's a cheap way to win a pot and a possible angle shoot, but I don't think it's breaking a rule. It's the dealer's responsibility to keep track of action, but are the players are supposed to help him do that? If he needs reminding more than once or twice, he's not keeping good control of the game.

ScottieK

fnurt · #6 08-11-2006, 03:37 PM

[ QUOTE ]
1, although the dealer should be on top of things enough so that this never gets to the second person folding behind you.

[/ QUOTE ]

Scooterdoo · #7 08-11-2006, 04:12 PM

so what happened? Did you win the hand along with the raise? I can't imagine how you could lose the hand if you didn't act yet and the cards speak for themselves -- you had a premium hand. If you have a hand like 76 I can see them ruling that you would not have called the bet anyway, but how can they say that with JJ?

AngusThermopyle · #8 08-11-2006, 04:19 PM

[ QUOTE ]

1. Should I speak up as soon as I see others playing out of turn
2. Speak up before the raisers cards are mucked
3. Not at all

[/ QUOTE ]

1. Yes. Welcome to live poker.
2-3. Should effectively result in the same outcome, since the ruling should be that your hand is dead. You might get the option to act if you say something before his hand is mucked, but once his hand is mucked, your hand should be dead.

VarlosZ · #9 08-11-2006, 11:29 PM

If a player notices a mistake that can be corrected or avoided, he should speak up whether or not he's in the hand. Not to do so just so you can win a pot on a technicality that arises out of a dealer's mistake is an obvious angle-shoot. Not against the rules, but clearly unethical behavior -- that's the nature of an angle-shoot.

MrBlueNose · #10 08-12-2006, 12:13 AM

[ QUOTE ]

1. Yes. Welcome to live poker.
2-3. Should effectively result in the same outcome, since the ruling should be that your hand is dead. You might get the option to act if you say something before his hand is mucked, but once his hand is mucked, your hand should be dead.

[/ QUOTE ]

Maybe I'm just not understanding it correctly, but why should heros hand be dead if it's villain that made the mistake? And theoretically, wouldn't that mean I can throw in a raise in a pot, then muck very fast before everyone's acted, thus their hands are dead? Sorry if I misunderstood wrong btw.