flop peel, two backdoor draws

mterry · #1 01-23-2006, 01:20 AM

I just moved up to 15/30 now that I have a bankroll for it. I'm pretty sure I should've folded pf or flop here. Table was pretty good. PF raiser is 38/16/2.96, MP1 is 30/15/1.69 both after 200+ hands.

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (8 handed) pokerhand.org hand converter

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img].
1 fold, Hero calls, MP1 calls, 1 fold, CO calls, 1 fold, SB completes, BB raises, Hero calls, MP1 calls, CO calls, SB calls.

Flop: (10 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB bets, Hero calls, MP1 raises, CO calls, SB folds, BB folds, Hero calls.

Turn: (8.50 BB) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (3 players)
Hero checks, MP1 bets, CO calls, Hero raises

What do you all think?

mr pink · #2 01-23-2006, 01:31 AM

table conditions have to be right for the limp preflop, you were there so whatever.

The flop is a fold. maybe peel if you're closing the action, but with 4 players to act after you it's just not worth it.

turn seems ok.

Moneyline · #3 01-23-2006, 02:37 AM

Preflop: If I'm going to limp in that spot with A8s then I want to be sure I'm in a loose/passive game. From the stats you provided on BB & MP1 it doesn't seem like the game would be passive, but with the stats you provided there really isn't enough information to tell.

Flop: I think this is bad. Even though the pot is big you are drawing thin, there's a very real risk that the pot will be raised behind you, and there's also a good chance your ace is dominated. Even if your call closed the action this would be a fold, but considering your crappy position this should be a very easy muck.

Just my opinion...

BobbyArmani · #4 01-23-2006, 03:44 AM

I only limp small suited aces in LP. The standard among most players here is to also limp in MP. Some will limp in EP but I consider that clearly wrong.

Calling this flop would be marginal at best if you were closing the action. Your relative position is "UTG", it's a clear fold.

What are you trying to accomplish with a turn raise? I'd prefer calling and seeing the river.

Hobbs. · #5 01-23-2006, 05:37 AM

I raise A8s 5 off the button a fair amount of the time. The flop call the first time around sucks a lot as you are not closing the action and thus open yourself up to exactly what happened.

Dazarath · #6 01-23-2006, 06:39 AM

Preflop: I'd fold unless the table was playing extremely loose-passive. On your average PP 15 table, I fold this 100% of the time, but I'm not sure what the table conditions were at your specific table.

Flop: This is a fold for the reason that others have said. You're giving yourself too many outs, and there's the possibility of it being raised behind you. It's a very marginal peel for 1 bet; if it's raised, it becomes very -EV. If you were closing the action, then that's a different story.