I pay off

[twang]

Sorry if this quesion is too general: how did you guys stop paying off so damn much (if that ever was a problem for you)?

To be honest, I pay off like a [censored] ATM. Other aspects of my game is pretty ok; I don't spew money on early streets or preflop, I don't chase without proper odds or good reason to belive that I have implied odds to do so, I play position, I bluff when I have a good spot etc etc. But when it comes to calling those big bets when someone catches a flukey hand on the river I have serious issues with laying down my flopped TPTK, top-two or set. Same goes for being outflopped by some raggedy two pair after betting heavily PF with AA or KK. I call huge bets (or 3-bet all in) on the flop all over the place if I have aces or kings. It's just awful and I feel like a [censored] idiot. I am basically one of those TAGs that overplay big hands, the kind of player that all those sexy LAGs feed upon. (FWIW I'm winning NL100/200, but not by very much. I'm pretty sure me being in the green is nothing more than variance and that there's still plenty of players that suck harder than I.)

Sorry if this was vague, but I'd appreciate if someone could provide links to posts on this matter or give me some input on the subject of paying off.

Thanks.

Edit: Never mind the location.

[californicator]

It's really a matter of reading into the texture of the board. If you had raised preflop with AA or KK as you've said, you've at least defined your hand to the other players. Facing an opponent that plays back at you, you've got to determine whether the board is one that facilitates your opponent having hit a set or 2-pair.

On flops like 9 7 4, I'd be more weary of a set. On a flop like J 10 5, I'd be worried about J/10 2-pair possibly, or someone holding KQ.

[jakerc]

imo this question is too broad to answer. everything in terms of paying off and whether or not you are a "pay off wizard" depends on your image, the texture of the board, and your reads on your opponent. there are some calls you could make against idiot donkeys that youd never dream of making against a weak-tight nit. i would say to post some hands and people will be able to help you out much better.

[twang]

Thanks.

I'm not sure I agree with your post though. Playing 6-max there's a lot of preflop raises and that (obviously) doesn't define one's hand much, unless you do some 10xbb pf-bet or there's a lot of re-raising going on. My problem is that I find it difficult to decide what the actions means based on the betting + the flop. In your 9 7 4 and J T 5 examples, I would think that 9 7 4 meant overpair, 9/good kicker OR two pair/set. Same goes for flop two - with some concern about the draw added.

A typical hand for me would be this: I hold 99 in LP and raise one limper. Flop comes 98A. Check, I bet 2/3, limper calls. Turn is a 3. Check, I bet 1/2, limper calls. River is a 5. Limper bets pot (which is pretty much the rest of the stack, given 100xbb starting stacks) and I call. (The alternative is that I am check-raised all in, which I call).

Obviously I'm thinking he flopped an OESD and hit his card on the river, but I'm also thinking strong ace, bluff, funny two pair etc, so I call. I have never ever folded a hand like that, I think, not even with deep stacks.

I'm most definitely a limit donk.

[kolotoure]

[ QUOTE ]
It's really a matter of reading into the texture of the board. If you had raised preflop with AA or KK as you've said, you've at least defined your hand to the other players. Facing an opponent that plays back at you, you've got to determine whether the board is one that facilitates your opponent having hit a set or 2-pair.

On flops like 9 7 4, I'd be more weary of a set. On a flop like J 10 5, I'd be worried about J/10 2-pair possibly, or someone holding KQ.

[/ QUOTE ]

If raising preflop means you define your hand as AA/KK you need to raise a lot more often

[jakerc]

you're not a donk for doing that, i would call that all day. there's two hands that beat you, 67 and AA, and the villain is probably taking action like this with A8, A9, 89, and probably AK & AQ.