NL100: Overs and a flush draw

PokerPadawan · #1 08-02-2006, 09:47 AM

I'm more of a limit player, so I'm looking for basic advice.

Villain is a typical loose passive from these limits. My UTG limp is experimental, so forget about that.

On the flop, the push is scary, but I had odds to call for my draw, and I don't think a passive player would do this with just a flush draw.

Did I play this OK, or could I have made a different play that would've showed that I was so far behind before costing me so much?

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Button ($115.40)
SB ($42.85)
BB ($111.50)
Hero ($66)
MP ($64.70)
CO ($43.55)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
Hero calls $1, 3 folds, SB raises to $3, 1 fold, Hero calls $2.

Flop: ($7) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets $4, Hero raises to $20, SB raises to $39.85, Hero calls $19.85.

meanjean · #2 08-02-2006, 10:12 AM

why raise the flop...if you call you get to see the turn for cheap

Thoth · #3 08-02-2006, 10:19 AM

Against a loose passive I think you have to call the flop.

He probably won't fire the turn with overcards, so you can try to pick up the pot then.
If he has an overpair he'll bet the turn again, but in that case you don't want to get your stack in as a 2:1 dog on the flop anyhow.

This only loses if he hits his 4-6 overcard outs on the turn when he would fold the flop, but I think not getting allin here vs an overpair more than makes up for that.

JackWilson · #4 08-02-2006, 10:19 AM

[ QUOTE ]
why raise the flop...if you call you get to see the turn for cheap

[/ QUOTE ]

It's a pretty standard semi-bluff...

meanjean · #5 08-02-2006, 10:23 AM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
why raise the flop...if you call you get to see the turn for cheap

[/ QUOTE ]

It's a pretty standard semi-bluff...

[/ QUOTE ]

I meant...why not just call instead of investing 20 to win 11 against a loose passive who raised preflop

Ben Young · #6 08-02-2006, 10:27 AM

I don't think you should be raising the flop, I'm befuddled as to the last action but I guess fold.

JackWilson · #7 08-02-2006, 10:48 AM

A bluff is hardly optimal against a loose player, but the OP's read is hardly very conclusive. He doesn't say anything about how loose he is after the flop etc. All I meant was I don't think the raise is such a weird play.

los_toros · #8 08-02-2006, 11:19 AM

Take the turn for cheap OOP and see if you can pick up more outs to play your hand faster.

tufat23 · #9 08-02-2006, 11:33 AM

fold or raise preflop. I don't like limping UTG, also I wouldn't consider the overs clean outs since he's not stacking off A7 here, more likely JJ. call flop.
I'd play this pretty passively, looking to give up turn if i dont improve and villain bets out strongly.

edit: reload preflop

ThePortuguee · #10 08-02-2006, 11:47 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think you should be raising the flop, I'm befuddled as to the last action but I guess fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Whoa, you're going to fold for the shove on the end? You have to call by virtue of your flush outs at this point, do you not?

I agree that this is probably a good spot to clal the flop, but raising is also fine. I'd probably go with more like 12 than 20, though.