$600NL: 2nd nuts on the flop (to settle an argument)

liucipher · #1 07-05-2006, 03:43 AM

i don't play these stakes, so my opinion is pretty worthless. my friend insists on the merit of his laydown and i think it's massively weak.

as hero's stack size shows, his style of play makes people think he's a little loose. hero's read is that the villain is tight w/ anything less than two pair.

at $50NL and $100NL where i play, i think i can't shove my chips in fast enough. but hero rapes midstakes NL at 20BB/100 while 4-tabling, so he clearly knows more than me. opinions?

for what it's worth, hero stacked villain later on in another hand w/ the nuts.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $6 BB (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

saw flop|saw showdown

MP ($617.75)
Button ($1230)
Hero ($1736.02)
BB ($546.75)
UTG ($413.05)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. Hero posts a blind of $3.
UTG calls $6, MP calls $6, Button calls $6, Hero (poster) completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($30) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (5 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG checks, MP checks, Button bets $24, Hero raises to $73, BB moves all-in for $540.75, UTG folds, MP folds, Button folds, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $127

Results in white below: 
No showdown.

liucipher · #2 07-05-2006, 03:47 AM

i would call here thinking 1.) 96 may not want to discourage action and move all-in given the lack of any apparent dominating draws 2.) top two pair, a set, or top pair + OESD would more likely try and close action 3.) there is already $200 in the pot and ~$450 more to call

in favor of a laydown 1.) villain was strong enough to check and risk giving 3 people behind him a free card 2.) he has seen a potsized raise and a 2/3 potsized reraise, yet feels compelled to 3bet all-in 3.) villain in BB makes hand read pretty difficult 4.) hero is a monster and could conceivably find better edges later on

Jinx · #3 07-05-2006, 06:14 AM

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20BB/100 while 4-tabling, so he clearly knows more than me.

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variance. As for hand, call all day.

liucipher · #4 07-05-2006, 05:03 PM

shameless bump. the argument is still unsettled. a simple "call/fold" recommendation will do. thanks!

Morrek · #5 07-05-2006, 05:05 PM

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call all day

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psuasskicker · #6 07-05-2006, 05:08 PM

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call all day

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Triumph36 · #7 07-05-2006, 05:13 PM

I will post a very similar hand where it was possible for me to get away, but in this instance you should call all day. He could have a ton of different hands.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (6 handed) internettexasholdem.com

BB ($202)
UTG ($120.20)
Hero ($528.10)
CO ($600.10)
Button ($65.71)
SB ($812.55)

Preflop: Hero is MP with 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $2.
UTG calls $4, Hero calls $4, CO calls $4, 1 fold, SB (poster) completes, BB checks.

Flop: ($20) 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
SB checks, BB bets $20, UTG folds, Hero raises to $60, CO folds, SB raises to $125, BB folds, Hero calls $65.

Turn: ($290) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
SB bets $250, Hero calls $399.10 (All-In), SB calls $149.10.

River: ($1088.20) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: $1088.20

Results below:
SB has 6d 9c (straight, nine high).
Hero has 6h 4h (straight, eight high).
Outcome: SB wins $1088.20.

Here I got min-check-raised into the field and then pot-bet on the turn - I played this hand about two months ago. I think now I could lay it down. In your example your opponent didn't try to give away the fact that he had the nuts, he just pushed, so he could have 87, a set, an overpair - who knows.

tcorbin16 · #8 07-05-2006, 05:15 PM

in the Op's hand i call all day.

aejones · #9 07-05-2006, 05:19 PM

Don't be a Nitty McNitterson. Please Call.

Jesus, Call. I dream of situations like this.

jalexand42 · #10 07-05-2006, 05:25 PM

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push your chips in the pot faster than Phil Hellmuth drawing dead

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FYP