$11, Playing a medium pair in position against cbet

[Potte]

How do I play on the turn here? Flop call is standard defence against cbet, right? He keeps betting on the turn, but he is giving me good pot odds to call him down. No reads yet.

PartyPoker $11 Regular Tournament, Big Blind is t40 (10 handed) Converter on pregopoker.com

UTG (t1920)
UTG+1 (t2000)
MP1 (t1960)
MP2 (t2220)
MP3 (t1980)
Hero (t1940)
CO (t2280)
Button (t1860)
SB (t1920)
BB (t1920)

Preflop: Hero is in CO+1 with 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
<font color="gray">UTG folds</font>, <font color="gray">UTG+1 folds</font>, <font color="gray">MP1 folds</font>, <font color="red">MP2 raises to t150</font>, <font color="gray">MP3 folds</font>, Hero calls t150, <font color="gray">CO folds</font>, <font color="gray">Button folds</font>, <font color="gray">SB folds</font>, <font color="gray">BB folds</font>

Flop: (t360) 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
<font color="red">MP2 bets t175</font>, Hero calls t175

Turn: (t710) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
<font color="red">MP2 bets t175</font>, Hero??

[KPL]

Usually I just fold to the raise preflop this early, especially in MP with four players left to act. I guess calling his c-bet on this dry flop is okay, but I wouldn't be too happy about it. I would called the weak turn bet as well.

[napkins]

I'd fold pf as well, especially when multitabling b/c its really hard to make read dependant plays, which you will inevitably have to do if you call and see this flop.

[KampnagelKid]

fold preflop
fold or raise flop
fold or raise turn
don't be a calling station.

[Potte]

[ QUOTE ]
fold preflop
fold or raise flop
fold or raise turn
don't be a calling station.

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't like raising and building a pot when I don't know where I stand. Also, folding seems way too weak on this flop. Can you tell me why calling this flop is a bad play? Except the fact that you generally don't like to call at all because that makes you a calling-station.

[aujoz]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't like raising and building a pot when I don't know where I stand. Also, folding seems way too weak on this flop. Can you tell me why calling this flop is a bad play? Except the fact that you generally don't like to call at all because that makes you a calling-station.


[/ QUOTE ]

Calling builds the pot as well, and puts you in an even worse position on the turn (bigger pot, hence more need to call, and opponent paid no extra for an extra card that has a chance to help them).

If you had raised on the flop, over the whole pot, you are unlikely to have put in significantly more chips, yet you have a massively higher chance of winning the pot.

[TruFloridaGator]

Fold PF. Stay out of these spots early.
Raise flop to see where you are and have a shot at taking it down. It wouldn't be uncommon for AK/AQ to fire again on the turn after your weak call.

[Potte]

Wow, so many says raise on the flop. I really thought calling was the standard play for cbet-defence. At least that's what Harrington says in HOH2 (p.16). Does anyone have another reference for these types of situations?

[TruFloridaGator]

[ QUOTE ]
Wow, so many says raise on the flop. I really thought calling was the standard play for cbet-defence. At least that's what Harrington says in HOH2 (p.16). Does anyone have another reference for these types of situations?

[/ QUOTE ]

Calling isn't horrible at higher stakes IMO, but they will float &amp; think 2 high cards are good here all day long at an $11. I would rather put in the raise on the flop because:
1) You can win the pot
2) You can shut him down
3) Find out more information

If you just call he could easily fire another bullet &amp; you have no clue if you should call or not. You end up burning just as much by calling him down if not more, as you would have by just putting in a raise on the flop.

[willbb99]

I'm pretty sure so many people are recommending a raise on the flop is because it lets you have a better idea where you stand. If you raise him and he calls or reraises you, you know you're not putting any more chips in the pot. You also have a chance to take down the pot immediately if he is c. betting with nothing. Calling gives you no new information and can force you to make tough decisions on the turn and river. At least that's my take on it. FWIW I also fold preflop.