Detrimental Short Win Sessions?

[Sirasoni]

Hi everyone, first post on the Pyschology Forum.

Some quick background information: I started playing poker a few months ago and only until recently (end of March or so) have I started becoming a winning player. Prior to this, I would be at .5/1 on Party grinding along, never doing much except for breaking even or having a marginal < 1 bb/100 winrate after much playing (I can't say for sure how many hands because I got PT too late, but I would estimate about ~35k). I would complain about bad beats and bad luck all the time (and yes I have come to the realization now that I was just simply playing badly) etc. and hated the downswings when they hit.

At the mid/end of April I started 2/4 fixed limit and so far I have been doing very well in terms of the short run. My problem however is that I will run up 40BB in a short amount of time and then quit my session. While making 40BB in about 200-400 hands is very exciting for me, I feel like it will have a longterm detrimental effect on me as a player. Back when I was grinding out .5/1 where I wasn't experiencing huge upswings, I would play at least 1000 hands per day. Now I am averaging 300 (except the days where I lose some money). I am pretty much attaching too high of a value to my money.

Am I correct that this will have an effect on me in the longrun? I know that downswings are inevitable, but I just have some natural urge to try and avoid that and leave while I'm ahead. I feel like if I keep this up, I will be emotionally shattered when I hit a typical long downswing at a higher stake, etc. Is there any way to shake off this mentality?

One last note: I have some feeling in the back of my mind that this huge upswing is just brilliant luck, and that I am actually a horrible player. Am I being paranoid?

Thanks in advance, everyone [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

[Pog0]

You're not being paranoid. Good players know why they win.

The reason you're quitting when ahead is because if you then fall behind you'll regret having played those extra hands. "Damnit, why didn't I quit while I was ahead." hindsight is 20/20. But the matter of the fact is that the game was profitable (probably) and you were unlucky to lose after your winnings rather than continue to win.

The biggest problem is this:

If you're having a losing session, you continue to play. If youi're having a winning session, you stop playing. Although variance is a HUGE factor, if you're winning, the games are more likely to be good and if you're losing the games are more likely to be bad. Thus, in the long run, you end up spending more time in the worse games and less time in the better games and that WILL effect your winrate.

Booking a winning session is always nice, but in the end, it costs us money for temporary psychological wellbeing.

Since getting over this complex would be more beneficial psychologically, then it is not worth sacrificing the money for the peace of mind anyway. Better to just learn to get through it. Adjusting always takes time. Just think back a few months when losing $x put you in a bad mood, and now you can lose $10x and not care at all (or if this doesn't apply to you, well, it will eventually if all goes well).

[_TKO_]

The game dynamic is a hard thing to get accustomed to.

[Sirasoni]

Thanks, Pog0 and TKO. These was exactly the type of responses I wanted, both of you were extremely helpful [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

[Pog0]

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks, Pog0 and TKO. These was exactly the type of responses I wanted, both of you were extremely helpful [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

[/ QUOTE ]

Glad I could help. TKO's response was more definitely excellent. However nothing either of us writes will ever be enough to get over an issue. You just have to practice. When you want to stop because of results, mentally slap yourself, rinse and repeat. Most of us just need to reinforce the idea that we can be playing well and losing.

Whenever someone gets out of a relationship they are much more sad than they were before it started, but they are still in the same place. It's probably even got a psychological name, but when we gain something and then lose it, we are worse off than had we never had it at all (money included). Just more demons to face to beat the cruel game of poker.

Funny thing, today I just played 10/20 for the first time (been playing 5/10 for the past ~43k hands and 3/6 before that).

I started up 60 bets, then quit while up 32 bets. Berated myself for a second for opening tables and staying (after losing $300 in a few seconds) and quickly realized how ridiculous that sounds.

Decided to book a win, since the psychological advantage of winning will probably help me better accustom myself to the larger $ swings.

Maybe having been down overall at 5/10 from hand #1 through hand #36,000 may have increased my desire to do this. Because of my initial 420 BB downswing (6max, also, I have improved so so much since then), I'm at 0.3BB/100 after 43k hands. Most people wouldn't recommend I move up after this evidence, but I know that I'm beating the game and the players better than this. I can see it in my plays, not in the results.

Now I need to practice losing $2k+ in a night and not caring.

[_TKO_]

[ QUOTE ]
Decided to book a win, since the psychological advantage of winning will probably help me better accustom myself to the larger $ swings.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is as true as it is untrue. If you are a winning player, then there are advantages to be winning during a particular session; however, if you are not a winning player, then incorrectly convincing yourself that you could be very, very costly.